Your experience with various coilers

[RETed]

It sounds like you want them under $1,000 (if possible) or just around that price...?

If so, you're going to have to give up some adjustability and options.

I absolutely do NOT touch anything China / Hong Kong / Taiwan / Korea.

Almost anything from Japan (legit) is overly stiff for street use - maybe I AM getting old. :P
This includes Tein.

Absolutely best street suspension I have ever been in an FC is a Koni yellows + Ground Control coilovers.
This is not so much the GC components, but the Koni's...
Koni's are Euro...you can't go wrong with Euro suspension components.

Koni yellows - by themselves, for the FC - are like $500 - $600 for all 4 corners.
Problem is that the fronts are "strut inserts," and you need the hack the bottom, stock MacPherson strut housing to make them work.
Also, these are not drop-in fitments, so the strut shaft are not the same dimensions as the stock pieces.

GC sells their coilover spring kit for $450 - $500.
Combine that with the Koni's and you're already at the $1,000 mark.
GC does sell a "premium" suspension package with their camber / caster plates for a cool $1,699 on their website.
The FC really doesn't need the caster adjustment, but the camber adjustment is welcome, especially if you drop the car significantly or want to fine tune the alignment settings for race...

Just to state the obvious, you can usually get the (GC) pieces (I would recommend you buy the Koni struts brand new) in good used condition, and springs don't usually go bad.
I know there's cheap coilover spring kits out there, and most of them would work with the Koni's (GASP!), but try and get name brand springs like Eibach, Hypercoil, etc.

One of the biggest problems with those complete coilover systems is that if they start to go bad - and they will - how will you service them?
Tein does have a USA service center.
Most of the other brand do NOT - even most of the Japan brands like Cusco, HKS, etc.
Your Koni's can be serviced by a number of authorized service centers around the country.

You want cheap?
Start with a set of KYB AGX's - these are the best bang-for-the-buck shocks for the FC...


-Ted

[project86]

Originally Posted by RETed

It sounds like you want them under $1,000 (if possible) or just around that price...?

If so, you're going to have to give up some adjustability and options.

I absolutely do NOT touch anything China / Hong Kong / Taiwan / Korea.

Almost anything from Japan (legit) is overly stiff for street use - maybe I AM getting old. :P
This includes Tein.

Im not afraid of stiff. My passenger might be but I'm not...

Originally Posted by RETed

Koni yellows - by themselves, for the FC - are like $500 - $600 for all 4 corners.
Problem is that the fronts are "strut inserts," and you need the hack the bottom, stock MacPherson strut housing to make them work.
Also, these are not drop-in fitments, so the strut shaft are not the same dimensions as the stock pieces.

I would really probably prefer a drop in option just for the convenience.. and if i have to pay for that then so be it.

Originally Posted by RETed

One of the biggest problems with those complete coilover systems is that if they start to go bad - and they will - how will you service them?
Tein does have a USA service center.
Most of the other brand do NOT - even most of the Japan brands like Cusco, HKS, etc.

I have considered that. Which is one reason why I was attracted to the BC set up other than the fact that I've actually been in cars that had them. At least i was under the impression that they could be serviced in the states.

Originally Posted by RETed

You want cheap?
Start with a set of KYB AGX's - these are the best bang-for-the-buck shocks for the FC...


-Ted

I'm really not overly concerned with cheap. I just don't want to unnecessarily spend more than i need to. I have Tokico blues and Eibach pro springs on the car now and i enjoyed them. But looking back on it i wish i would have just spend the extra couple three hundred on coilovers instead.

[chibikougan]

You guys quit making me want another FC....

[Pete_89T2]

Originally Posted by project86

Ted. I really just plan on spirited street driving and maybe some occasional track use (autox or road racing) if the opportunity presents itself.

IF that's how the car will be used, THEN...

Originally Posted by RETed

Start with a set of KYB AGX's - these are the best bang-for-the-buck shocks for the FC...


-Ted

^Go with this, and a few other suspension bits you'll be super happy. I use my FC the same as you, and my setup started with the KYB AGX's. At the same time I put those in, I installed a set of Racing Beat springs, and later on replaced most of the stock bushings with the Energy Suspension polyurethane replacements (i.e, stabilizer bar bushings, front/rear control arms, etc.). Also added the Racing Beat "DTSS eliminator" bushings, because it felt like the stock DTSS bushings were worn out, and made the rear end handle unpredictably at the limits.

I'm still on stock wheels & tire sizes, and am very happy with this setup.

[project86]

Originally Posted by Pete_89T2

^Go with this, and a few other suspension bits you'll be super happy. I use my FC the same as you, and my setup started with the KYB AGX's. At the same time I put those in, I installed a set of Racing Beat springs, and later on replaced most of the stock bushings with the Energy Suspension polyurethane replacements (i.e, stabilizer bar bushings, front/rear control arms, etc.). Also added the Racing Beat "DTSS eliminator" bushings, because it felt like the stock DTSS bushings were worn out, and made the rear end handle unpredictably at the limits.

I'm still on stock wheels & tire sizes, and am very happy with this setup.

So... this is where i might sound silly....... but i want the to be able to make the car as low as I feel like. Im not one of the "hella flush" fan boys or anything but i do like to aggressive look of a low FC and I'm not planning on running stock size/offset wheels. I am about to replace all the suspension bushings with the same kit and getting the rear toe steer eliminator bushings.

Would you mind posting some pictures of what your car looks like with your set up?

[Pete_89T2]

Originally Posted by project86

Would you mind posting some pictures of what your car looks like with your set up?

Here you go... this was at DGRR, last year or year before, forget which but same suspension & stock wheels.

[RETed]

Originally Posted by project86

So... this is where i might sound silly....... but i want the to be able to make the car as low as I feel like. Im not one of the "hella flush" fan boys or anything but i do like to aggressive look of a low FC and I'm not planning on running stock size/offset wheels. I am about to replace all the suspension bushings with the same kit and getting the rear toe steer eliminator bushings.

Watch out...

The FC doesn't like going that low without running into major camber problems, especially in the rear.
An (upright) rear camber adjust rod will only take out so much (negative) camber in the rear.
Even with the adjustable links on the front of the rear subframe, you end up smacking the whole thing on compression.
Pete_89T2's pic looks like it has a smidgen too much camber in the rear, or it's a weird illusion of the pic due to the compression of the suspension due to the turn...

You'd get away with about 2 - 3 "fingers" of gap in the rear before there is really too much (negative) camber.
Remember, rear camber hurts your straight-line acceleration due to inefficient contact patch of the rear tires (upon acceleration).
It also causes uneven tire wear back there.

Fronts are no problem due to almost any off-the-shelf front camber plates can dial it all out.
It's still a bit problem in the rear on really drastic drops...


-Ted

[project86]

Originally Posted by RETed

Watch out...

The FC doesn't like going that low without running into major camber problems, especially in the rear.
An (upright) rear camber adjust rod will only take out so much (negative) camber in the rear.
Even with the adjustable links on the front of the rear subframe, you end up smacking the whole thing on compression.
Pete_89T2's pic looks like it has a smidgen too much camber in the rear, or it's a weird illusion of the pic due to the compression of the suspension due to the turn...

You'd get away with about 2 - 3 "fingers" of gap in the rear before there is really too much (negative) camber.
Remember, rear camber hurts your straight-line acceleration due to inefficient contact patch of the rear tires (upon acceleration).
It also causes uneven tire wear back there.

Fronts are no problem due to almost any off-the-shelf front camber plates can dial it all out.
It's still a bit problem in the rear on really drastic drops...


-Ted

EDIT: just remembered Mazdatrix sells rear camber links to adjust it... im unsure what the mechanical limits are though.

[Pete_89T2]

Originally Posted by RETed

Pete_89T2's pic looks like it has a smidgen too much camber in the rear, or it's a weird illusion of the pic due to the compression of the suspension due to the turn...

^I noticed that in the picture too, and wondered why it looked that way. I always assumed it's just the lateral-G loading combined with the wavy road surface crowning. The RB springs I have are supposed to lower the car about 3/4", but when I measured the difference (from subframe rails to my garage floor), the difference was only about 1/4" lower than with my stock springs & shocks. Granted, the stock springs were likely worn out and sagging when I replaced them.