cooling issue....custom car

craig3x · 02-24-2010, 01:25 AM

I have a 914 porsche with a 13b. having trouble keeping it cool. I am using a ford f-150 radiator which is mounted way up front. (engine is in the rear). You'd think that with the coolant traveling all the way to the front of the car, then going through that big radiator, then all the way back to the engine, that it would be plenty cool....but it's not. Running around 200 degrees and sometimes it tries to get up to 210 degrees, but I shut her down. Yes, I am also using a radiator cooling fan.
Do they make aftermarket water pumps to help? or different pullies for the water pump? Any ideas?

RotaryProphet · 02-24-2010, 08:38 AM

I would start with some sort of electric pump, perhaps even just a booster pump. Something like this, perhaps: http://www.jegs.com/p/Stewart-Compon...61611/10002/-1

The stock pump is certainly going to have a bit of trouble drawing water from the radiator at that distance, particularly if a large portion of the radiator is below the water pump's inlet level.

Kentetsu · 02-24-2010, 10:53 AM

A few questions:

What fan are you using, and what type of controller?
What temp does the fan come on at?
What temperature thermostat are you using?
Is there any possibility that the belt is slipping?
When does the problem occur? At idle, only after a hard run, etc.?

djmtsu · 02-24-2010, 11:46 AM

I was going to suggest a booster pump as well.

Or just block off the water pump and run a high volume inline water pump. You might need an alternator upgrade to run one, and you would want to make some kind of simple circuit wired to a dummy light incase the pump fails to operate.

My .02

craig3x · 02-24-2010, 12:59 PM

The problem actually seems to happen more often at cruising. I like the electric pump idea, but not $400 for it.
My radiator is mounted so that it does get a good ammount of air moving through it. Right now, I am using a black magic fan that is controlled by a switch on my dash. I pretty much leave it on the whole time except for warming the car up. I am using a 185 degree thermostat. Should I possibly remove it all together?

DJMTSU- can you explain what you were talking about with blocking off the water pump and using a high volume? How does it operate? pics??

Does anyone know if they make different pullies for the stock pump to increase it's flow?

***TitaniumTT*** · 02-24-2010, 01:04 PM

First of all, 200-210 is not that hot and isn't really a concern, I WISH my car would run that hot.

Get something to automatically control the fan. On @ 190, off @ 185 kinda thing.

Like Prophet says, a booster pump would help alot, but I don't think that's your problem, I think the radiator is. You're using a stock rad for a I6 or V8, I would call Griffen and start picking thier brains. If you've managed to get a good sized rad like that in there, than a better quality, better engineered, full alloy rad would do wonders for you.

Like I said though, 200 isn't anything to worry about.

djmtsu · 02-24-2010, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craig3x

DJMTSU- can you explain what you were talking about with blocking off the water pump and using a high volume? How does it operate? pics??

Does anyone know if they make different pullies for the stock pump to increase it's flow?

I saw a set up on a drag FC once. Where the water pump mounts, he just had a plate bolted down. The electric pump was mounted on the fender, with the lower radiator hose going in one side, than out to the engine. It ran at a constant speed when the ignition was switched on. He said it was something he learned from Nascar school (for whatever that is worth), and the pump was available at Summit or Jegs.

But, listen to TT. He is one smart SOB. Get some serious ducting to that radiator, and upgrade to a thicker aluminum set-up.

dudemaaan · 02-24-2010, 03:14 PM

Yeah 200-210 isnt dangerous, though it's warmer then I like to see. I like mine to be around 190. Are you running a fan shroud? Those help tremendously. Also ducting, make sure any gaps around the radiator are sealed, any air hitting the radiator needs to go through it, gaps will just allow it to escape around the sides.

craig3x · 02-24-2010, 03:31 PM

yes, using a shround and have the air being guided through the fins as much as possible. Also have a heat escape scoop on my hood. You can see in my video. link is below. Money is a bit tight, so I was hoping for some "cheap answers". ha, like that is ever possible!

craig3x · 02-24-2010, 03:31 PM

does anyone have any pictures of the bypass plate on the waterpump?

Kentetsu · 02-24-2010, 04:11 PM

How confident are you that your gauge is correct?

Oh yeah, make sure your timing is correct too. If it is too retarded, it will overheat the exhaust system. Too advanced and it will overheat the motor.

FerociousP · 02-24-2010, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craig3x

does anyone have any pictures of the bypass plate on the waterpump?

Think of the water pump shape. and then think of a flat plate in its place....

The other option would be to get the smaller plate (water pump housing to block) and putting large -AN fittings routed to an electric pump...

craig3x · 02-24-2010, 06:21 PM

if I went electric pump route, could I just leave my waterpump in place? wouldn't that be easier?

FerociousP · 02-24-2010, 06:48 PM

the impeller may be in the way... you may want to get ccreative on that part.

dudemaaan · 02-24-2010, 08:10 PM

What PSI pressure cap are you running? Have you pressure tested the system and made sure absolutely no air is in there?

02-24-2010, 01:25 AM	#1
craig3x Rotary Fan in Training Join Date: Feb 2010 iTrader: (0) Posts: 37 Rep Power: 0	cooling issue....custom car I have a 914 porsche with a 13b. having trouble keeping it cool. I am using a ford f-150 radiator which is mounted way up front. (engine is in the rear). You'd think that with the coolant traveling all the way to the front of the car, then going through that big radiator, then all the way back to the engine, that it would be plenty cool....but it's not. Running around 200 degrees and sometimes it tries to get up to 210 degrees, but I shut her down. Yes, I am also using a radiator cooling fan. Do they make aftermarket water pumps to help? or different pullies for the water pump? Any ideas? __________________ 74 porsche 914 with 13b rotary http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0CUlLecxbo 73 914 porsche 1.7

02-24-2010, 10:53 AM	#3
Kentetsu RCC Contributor Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan iTrader: (1) Posts: 530 Rep Power: 17	A few questions: What fan are you using, and what type of controller? What temp does the fan come on at? What temperature thermostat are you using? Is there any possibility that the belt is slipping? When does the problem occur? At idle, only after a hard run, etc.? __________________ "Learn from the past, or it will become your future...." '85 GS 12a + LSD/Sterling carb/Respeed coilovers/Respeed front swaybar/Respeed adj. rear spring perches/Illuminas/Bilsteins on rear AutoX vids @ http://www.youtube.com/user/Kentetsu1

02-24-2010, 11:46 AM	#4
djmtsu My minds tellin' me no... Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Murfreesboro, TN iTrader: (10) Posts: 4,043 Rep Power: 21	I was going to suggest a booster pump as well. Or just block off the water pump and run a high volume inline water pump. You might need an alternator upgrade to run one, and you would want to make some kind of simple circuit wired to a dummy light incase the pump fails to operate. My .02 __________________ 1976 Mazda Cosmo RX-5 1976 Mazda Cosmo RX-5 2003 Toyota Tundra TRD 2015 Toyota 4Runner SR5

02-24-2010, 12:59 PM	#5
craig3x Rotary Fan in Training Join Date: Feb 2010 iTrader: (0) Posts: 37 Rep Power: 0	The problem actually seems to happen more often at cruising. I like the electric pump idea, but not $400 for it. My radiator is mounted so that it does get a good ammount of air moving through it. Right now, I am using a black magic fan that is controlled by a switch on my dash. I pretty much leave it on the whole time except for warming the car up. I am using a 185 degree thermostat. Should I possibly remove it all together? DJMTSU- can you explain what you were talking about with blocking off the water pump and using a high volume? How does it operate? pics?? Does anyone know if they make different pullies for the stock pump to increase it's flow? __________________ 74 porsche 914 with 13b rotary http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0CUlLecxbo 73 914 porsche 1.7

02-24-2010, 01:04 PM	#6
*TitaniumTT* Test Whore - Admin Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Right Behind you son iTrader: (4) Posts: 4,581 Rep Power: 10	First of all, 200-210 is not that hot and isn't really a concern, I WISH my car would run that hot. Get something to automatically control the fan. On @ 190, off @ 185 kinda thing. Like Prophet says, a booster pump would help alot, but I don't think that's your problem, I think the radiator is. You're using a stock rad for a I6 or V8, I would call Griffen and start picking thier brains. If you've managed to get a good sized rad like that in there, than a better quality, better engineered, full alloy rad would do wonders for you. Like I said though, 200 isn't anything to worry about. __________________ -The Angry Stig- DGRR 2009, 2011, 2012 & 2013 - Best FC DEALS GAP!! WOOHOOOO!!!!! 2015 Audi S4 - Samantha - Zero Brap S4 2004 RX8 - Jocelyn - 196rwhp, 19mpg fuel to noise converter 2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Wifey mobile - Now with 2.5" OME lift and 30" BFG AT KO's! So it begins 1998 Jeep Cherokee - 5 spd, 4" lift, 33" BFG's - Rotary Tow Vehicle 1988 'Vert - In progress 1988 FC Coupe - Gretchen -The attention whore BEAST! I'm a sick individual, what's wrong with you? I'm pure Evil I'm still insane, in the best possible way. I think Brian's idea of romance is using lube. Your rage caused the meteor strike in Russia. The Antichrist would be proud of his minion. You win with your thread. Most everything It's a truck with a steel gate on the back. Just a statement of fact Motec M820, AIM dash, ported 13B-RE Cosmo, 6-spd trans, 4.3 Torsen, custom twin wg fully divided mani, Custom 4" split into 2x 3" exhaust, Custom HMIC, Custom custom custom custom I like to welder stuff.... No Bolt-ons allowed. Dyno'ed @ Speed1 Tuned by me - 405rwhp on WG.... WM50 cuming soon. *-Angry Motherfcker Mode ENGAGED-**

02-24-2010, 08:38 AM	#2
RotaryProphet Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Sep 2008 iTrader: (0) Posts: 147 Rep Power: 17	I would start with some sort of electric pump, perhaps even just a booster pump. Something like this, perhaps: http://www.jegs.com/p/Stewart-Compon...61611/10002/-1 The stock pump is certainly going to have a bit of trouble drawing water from the radiator at that distance, particularly if a large portion of the radiator is below the water pump's inlet level.

02-24-2010, 03:14 PM	#8
dudemaaan Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Brenham, TX iTrader: (4) Posts: 335 Rep Power: 17	Yeah 200-210 isnt dangerous, though it's warmer then I like to see. I like mine to be around 190. Are you running a fan shroud? Those help tremendously. Also ducting, make sure any gaps around the radiator are sealed, any air hitting the radiator needs to go through it, gaps will just allow it to escape around the sides. __________________ 500+ HP thanks to: Fast reacting IAT sensor thread! Mechanical Pre-turbo Water Injection Thread Dual Stock fuel pumps Thread T2 differential swap!

02-24-2010, 03:31 PM	#9
craig3x Rotary Fan in Training Join Date: Feb 2010 iTrader: (0) Posts: 37 Rep Power: 0	yes, using a shround and have the air being guided through the fins as much as possible. Also have a heat escape scoop on my hood. You can see in my video. link is below. Money is a bit tight, so I was hoping for some "cheap answers". ha, like that is ever possible! __________________ 74 porsche 914 with 13b rotary http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0CUlLecxbo 73 914 porsche 1.7

02-24-2010, 04:11 PM	#11
Kentetsu RCC Contributor Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan iTrader: (1) Posts: 530 Rep Power: 17	How confident are you that your gauge is correct? Oh yeah, make sure your timing is correct too. If it is too retarded, it will overheat the exhaust system. Too advanced and it will overheat the motor. Last edited by Kentetsu; 02-24-2010 at 04:14 PM..

02-24-2010, 06:21 PM	#13
craig3x Rotary Fan in Training Join Date: Feb 2010 iTrader: (0) Posts: 37 Rep Power: 0	if I went electric pump route, could I just leave my waterpump in place? wouldn't that be easier? __________________ 74 porsche 914 with 13b rotary http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0CUlLecxbo 73 914 porsche 1.7

02-24-2010, 06:48 PM	#14
FerociousP I-had-a-bad-experience... Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: M'boro iTrader: (2) Posts: 1,046 Rep Power: 18	the impeller may be in the way... you may want to get ccreative on that part. __________________ '15 Juke Nismo '06 MX-5 GT SOLD '04 S Silver RX-8 GT Track Day Use SOLD '90 Black TII vert w/ Sprint RE stock port/turbo DD dyno (242.6whp@5500rpm @12psi 8psi@redline) and (250ftlbtq@4800rpm @13psi) SOLD '89 GTUs 6p TII SOLD, '87 sport SOLD, '79 SA stock SOLD '91 B2600i 4x4 w/ Rx-8 LSD SOLD

02-24-2010, 08:10 PM	#15
dudemaaan Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Brenham, TX iTrader: (4) Posts: 335 Rep Power: 17	What PSI pressure cap are you running? Have you pressure tested the system and made sure absolutely no air is in there? __________________ 500+ HP thanks to: Fast reacting IAT sensor thread! Mechanical Pre-turbo Water Injection Thread Dual Stock fuel pumps Thread T2 differential swap!