20B N/A with RX8 rotors??

[warwickben]

dregg100 pm sent.

[RotaryProphet]

Originally Posted by dregg100

im not trying to start an argument, but you are wrong my friend. the leadings are the ones that fire at the same time. take an FD for example, the leading plugs have one coil. two plug wires coming off of one coil and two harness wires going to it(12v+ and signal). then there are two trailing coils. each coil has one wire coming off for a spark plug and two harness wires going to it (again 12v+ and signal) now tell me how it is that the leadings fire independently based on that?

normally i would keep my mouth shut, but running a setup like you have mentioned kills power and on a boosted setup risks blowing the engine(i think you are still na) hell it may blow up an na, i honestly dont know. im just speaking from every car i have built, not a schematic someone drew up.

Actually, if you look at his schematic (I just did, to figure out what this was all about), he has the sensor that fires the leading plugs split to two coils, so as to fire both the leading at the same time, then the trailing fires as per stock through the distributor. I ran my ~400hp turbo bridgeport 12a this way (although through a pair of MSD boxes) for months. Your hung up on the fact that there's two leading coils and one trailing, which makes you think the leading is firing at different times, but what you're ignoring is that the trailing is still firing through the distributor, and both leading coils are wired to the same signal, and so they both fire at the same time. It's a spark power issue, not a spark timing issue, all the coils still fire based on the distributor's sensor.

[warwickben]

Thanks. I was going to run a singal msd box then found out the down sides of it with a rotary. The great thing about this is it only cost me 45 for the ignitors and 30 for the 3rd coil.

Jeff20b is work on a setup like this for 20b's and the 4 rotor he is building.

[dregg100]

Originally Posted by RotaryProphet

Actually, if you look at his schematic (I just did, to figure out what this was all about), he has the sensor that fires the leading plugs split to two coils, so as to fire both the leading at the same time, then the trailing fires as per stock through the distributor. I ran my ~400hp turbo bridgeport 12a this way (although through a pair of MSD boxes) for months. Your hung up on the fact that there's two leading coils and one trailing, which makes you think the leading is firing at different times, but what you're ignoring is that the trailing is still firing through the distributor, and both leading coils are wired to the same signal, and so they both fire at the same time. It's a spark power issue, not a spark timing issue, all the coils still fire based on the distributor's sensor.

i forgot about the dizzy!!

[rotaryextreme]

I LOVE RCC because it is so much more civilized then other rotray forum's. This was a very nice way that things were discused in difference. Other forums you get flamed and labeled...ugh.

Ben

[warwickben]

iam so used to getting flamed on the other site. i had a huge problem when i put that ignition setup in my car. the coils arced out ect ect ect. turned out i used a 1981 dizzy wiring drawing for the dizzy to ignitors. turned out all i had to do was swap red and green. 15 post calling me dumb ect read the manual search ect. iam one of the few people on that site with this setup with a 80 dizzy lol yeah no help.

any ways i hope the build on your na motors is coming along good ect.

[dregg100]

updates?

[RX8Ualiv]

has anyone looked at the rotary in the mazda furai prototype? it has a
renesis based R20b, which means that it has multiside ports, a more
powerful coil setup, high compression renesis rotors, and is N/A.
it produces 450 whp on E100 ethanol, but will run on good premium fuel
like shell v-power 93 octane. Racing Beat developed the motor under
cooperation with Mazda Motorsports, and i would like to get more
technical specs. i do know that the e-shaft and rotor assembly is
lightened and computer balanced and has what we could call a
stage 2 street/race port job, and a sprocket drive setup
with a better high flow oil pump and aluminum rotor housings
to replace the ones that are cast iron, which is lighter and
dissipates heat more efficiently, ceramic apex seals, and only consumes
half of the oil of the earlier 20b.
if anyone knows anything more please add to this thread, as i would
like to find out the exact specs as i intend do install this with a T56
6-speed and a l99-00 vette differential with a custom track bar, custom rear
trailing arms and custom a-arms.

[RETed]

You're asking about an engine in a prototype vehicle...?
Uh, good luck.


-Ted

[gmonsen]

As Herblenny knows, I have an FD powered by a 20b NA using high compression Rx8 rotors, monster street port, custom headers, ignition, with rotating assembly balanced to 10,000 rpm. It was making around 360-365 WHP in early runs. I haven't played with it at all over the winter, but will be tuning it this spring. I don't think it can do better than maybe 375 even at 9,500-10,000, if it can even get enough air there. (But it sounds great at those rpm's...)

The power is just fine, as this setup was developed for linear power, instant response, big low down torque, reliability, and great sound.

Gordon

[malekith]

Originally Posted by RotaryProphet

I actually ran those throttle bodies (obviously the two rotor, not the three rotor version) on my stock internal 12a motor (with a big honking Master Power 70mm turbo on it, and a Megasquirt controlling EFI) and made 238 RWHP @ 13.5 PSI of boost. They're -fantastic- throttle bodies, and I have the dyno sheets to prove it.

The same exact setup but with my bridgeport 12a yielded 398 horsepower at the flywheel on my engine dyno @ 7psi of boost at 11,250 RPM. So they can definitely breath. (Side note, the engine was practically un-driveable on the road... so.. yeah. What do you expect?)

Curious as to the liftime of the turboed stock internal 12a... how many miles have you driven it for and are you willing to provide details for the build?

[GtoRx7]

Originally Posted by Herblenny

I've seen his work and talked to the guy who helped put it together...But his is EFI NA.. I believe. My guy is whom I trust and knows quite a bit about carb... he's just not sure about Renesis rotors as he hasn't taken one apart.. i'm thinking about bringing him one this weekend to take apart and compare the rotors.

I'm also waiting to hear back from Carlos Lopez. He and I talked about this before as my builder wanted to go NA/Carb 20B... now I'm thinking it might be easier and unique...

This is the picture Carlos sent me about a year ago.. I think this is the set up I'm now considering...

Hey Herblenny, I know you posted this a while ago and dont want to be late to the party but there is a little issue with this post. Did Carlos Lopez send you that picture and actually tell you he built that intake system? Because that is the intake system I built and had countless hours and money making. I sold it to a guy in new zealand and he put it on his 1st gen (your picture). I ordered the tweak-it throttle bodies, and had to do alot of revisions making them adapt, cutting them apart, custom balance bar with a custom adapter plate, custom intake manifold flange, custom fuel rail and holders etc etc. It basically used two old race 13b manifolds modified tremendously to fit the 20b. Carlos gave me the idea to use those two 13b race manifolds, and that was it.