Turbo manifold design

[speedjunkie]

LOL. Well thanks for the input, but where I'm deployed to right now, I can't see any pics on imageshack, so I can't see anything but the last pic of the magazine article LOL. I've seen your pics before though and I love your setup.

Also, I'm not selling my turbo (that I just bought) and I'm keeping the engine I have, unless it blows or something. I may have to rebuilt it already, but that's only if I determine that it's the engine burning oil and not the turbo. I can't see the HKS manifold and I haven't even seen my new turbo yet because I'm not home, so I have no idea if they would work together. I'm trying to get the manifold made with 321 stainless, and the main thing I was getting at with all this was if anyone could see a problem with moving the turbo back and down. Also, if there were any benefits or drawbacks to doing this, but I know what you're saying about opinions lol. I wondered if it might raise some sort of debate about response. I guess we'll see. Oh, I'm also planning on running two wastegates, one off each runner, probably around 38mm. The turbo supposedly flows 65lbs and the two wg should cover me I figure. I miss the responsiveness of the stock twins, so I'm going more for quick spool rather than high hp.

Oh, and I'm not planning on even putting this on a dyno, so I wouldn't know the HP numbers anyway. Every time that car is on a dyno something tragic happens. I lost oil seals in a brand new turbo one time and an engine another, and possibly a brand new (rebuilt) engine again. The turbo oil seals was my fault haha. The first engine maybe my fault, the last one definitely not (if it is in fact bad).

I'm also using the J-spec tranny, so my gearing so far hasn't allowed me to reach anything even close to 210 haha. Actually I don't think I've even tried to reach that haha.

[RICE RACING]

I commissioned one exhaust manifold from some place once made from 321 stainless, was made to fit HKSGT2 60mm gate and had egt's welded in etc, it was a nice piece short runner like the pics you cant see lol. (but you know what it looks like already) ....... the thing with 321 when you weld it also with 321 filler is its weld pool is "dirty" and the welds sort of come out just like when you use too much heat on 304L if you know what I mean? anyway get it made from 321 and it will last you about 20 engine and turbo oil seals

I tried the long header crap about 10 years ago. Many many people copied me,a and it in short if a con job on rotaries. it just does not work and you have way too many negatives that offset any type of gains associated with running what I call "Horse Cock Manifolds".

My "opinion" is keep it short, keep it divided, keep it direct into the turbo, this will yield massive response, most energy utilization, lowest turbine inlet pressure, most power, any heat losses you have always mean you need to make up the other two of the three things that drive the compressor wheel, FLOW, PRESSURE, HEAT.... Loose any one of these and the other needs to go up to keep the energy equation balanced.

Good luck with it BTW

[mattallac]

Question to rice racing:I have read that the outlet from the waste gate to the exhaust needs to be at least 18 inches long . What is your opinion on that?

[RICE RACING]

Originally Posted by mattallac

Question to rice racing:I have read that the outlet from the waste gate to the exhaust needs to be at least 18 inches long . What is your opinion on that?

Probably have to balance outright power at peak rpm to to rest of the power band, bringing the gas in a bit later would not directly impact on the turbine efficiency at a guess.

I don't want to bore people with my technical shit BDC HC style but you can see the pressure build up in the exhaust as the waste gate is cycling to build up the boost to a new higher target (so the high pressure turbine inlet pressure does obviously effect the Turbine outlet pressure in those conditions) Ideal would be to vent the waste gate on its own for mega powered set up's, but I do believe that a good balance of exhaust pressure (turbine outlet pressure) to (intake manifold pressure) actually improves the engine power band. If its way lower it will give you more top end but at the expense of mid range power/response. This seems to have an effect even on stock ported rotaries.

I have a nice detailed picture of the 2lt 145 inches of mercury boosted 3SGTE motor in Millen's Pikes Peak Racer and that thing at 950bhp does not have the WG 18 inches down stream (it does go right back into the exhaust outlet shortly after the turbine exit), so go figure, maybe he should have read the internet more

[RICE RACING]

Fuck that is a nice looking turbo!

[RICE RACING]

This turbo like the sierra sierra cunts run would be nice to use, it looks good too. > read more here > http://www.importtuner.com/features/...x/viewall.html

EFR 9180 ~900bhp @ 2.4 bar boost pressure

[RICE RACING]

The long to short runner thing is a classic and it WILL do your head in LOL.

One of the classic examples of a horse cock manifold is to look up the old TWINS TURBO converted Red Time Attack FD3S, running massive horse cock exhaust manifold with BW turbo and PENI GROW on steroids 5" dump pipe! and 4" exhaust !!!! you can actually see video of it doing ~480rwhp on the interwebz on a dynapack machine when set to ~20psi boost pressure. The amount of fab work and shit on that engine bay set up is homo in the extreme for very little return in performance.

You can see at least two other examples of short manifold cars running same or less boost and dyno'd on the exact same dyno types returning more power and with the same power band if not actually better. All around 500rwhubhp @ 1.3 bar boost pressure.

[mattallac]

Rice I have talked to you before about a t3t4 or t4 .I'm gonna stay with the t4 like you advised ,you also gave me some good info on how to get the turbo to spool faster ,my WG goes to atmosphere now ,if i run the WG outlet into the exhaust will it create better mid range for my street port ? Because it is fucking loud.