Recently rebuilt 2nd gen suddenly won't start - where to begin?

MmSadda · 03-28-2011, 11:20 PM

Okay, here's the deal -

I'm driving an S4 (87) n/a, stock for all practical purposes, got about 25k miles on a rebuilt engine, and at the same time got new fuel pump, new injectors, new ignition coils, etc.

I drove the car two days ago, and it ran 100% normal. Tried to start it today, and it'll sit there and crank and crank but won't actually fire up so I think I'm either not getting fuel or not getting a spark.

What's a good starting point as far as things to test?

**I should note, the guy who rebuilt my engine installed a kill switch (pretty sure it's for the fuel injectors, in case the engine floods)

tweiss3 · 03-29-2011, 06:35 AM

Did you try "flood" starting it, put the pedal in the floor and crank it? See if it turns over then.

RETed · 03-29-2011, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweiss3

Did you try "flood" starting it, put the pedal in the floor and crank it? See if it turns over then.

This does not work for any S4 vehicle.

-Ted

tweiss3 · 03-29-2011, 07:03 AM

Oops, works on my S5. I forgot. Pull the plugs and crank for 15 seconds, reinstall plugs and see if it starts up.

djmtsu · 03-29-2011, 08:13 AM

Shouldn't the tach 'bounce' if it is getting spark?

I forget.

vex · 03-29-2011, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djmtsu

Shouldn't the tach 'bounce' if it is getting spark?

I forget.

Yes, but that only indicates a specific coil is firing.

RXTASY · 03-29-2011, 10:52 AM

Pull the plug wires and put a screw driver to the tip of them and see if there is a spark arcing.
If there is, pull your two leading plugs, and yer EGI fuse and turn it over and blow all the gas out of it. Squirt a little motor oil in there while yer at it.
Try that.

MmSadda · 03-29-2011, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweiss3

Oops, works on my S5. I forgot. Pull the plugs and crank for 15 seconds, reinstall plugs and see if it starts up.

Thanks for jumping in here!

What will that do? If it's a cure for flooding, the kill switch works for that. If it's supposed to cute something else, lemme know and I'll try it!

Quote:

Originally Posted by djmtsu

Shouldn't the tach 'bounce' if it is getting spark?

I forget.

My tach 'bounced' all of once in the whole time I was trying... so it does sound like I may not be getting spark. What would I do to test/confirm this?

MmSadda · 03-29-2011, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RXTASY

Pull the plug wires and put a screw driver to the tip of them and see if there is a spark arcing.
If there is, pull your two leading plugs, and yer EGI fuse and turn it over and blow all the gas out of it. Squirt a little motor oil in there while yer at it.
Try that.

As in, screwdriver in one hand, and one plug wire end in the other, right? how far apart should I hold them?

If there's no spark arcing, that means my trailing coil is not functioning, then, right?

FC Zach · 03-29-2011, 11:20 AM

I typically just leave a plug in the end of the wire and ground it, have a helping hand to turn it over, and while that is going on you can observe whether or not there is spark. Screwdriver works too, just a little cumbersome to me.

Redshft · 03-29-2011, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FC Zach

I typically just leave a plug in the end of the wire and ground it, have a helping hand to turn it over, and while that is going on you can observe whether or not there is spark. Screwdriver works too, just a little cumbersome to me.

This.
But, having been zapped before, I'm now paranoid and I use a set of pliers with an insulated handle to hold the plug by the boot on the wire.

FRED · 03-29-2011, 12:19 PM

Watch the tach needle while trying to start the engine. IF the needle makes small movements that tells you a lot. It tells you that the ENGINE fuse, both EGI fuse are all good and that the main relay is pulling in.

Engine will not start with a blown EGI fuse(s), engine fuse, period.

IF the needle does make movements try deflooding it by the usual methods. I assume you don't have a blown apex seal when saying this and you have gas in the tank and there is no fuel cut switch in the OFF position.

EDIT: And or ...........put a jumper in the fuel pump check connector and the key put to ON. The fuel pump should be heard running. If not.......too bad, something is amiss.

My5ABaby · 03-29-2011, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MmSadda

Thanks for jumping in here!

What will that do? If it's a cure for flooding, the kill switch works for that. If it's supposed to cute something else, lemme know and I'll try it!

Pulling the fuse does essentially the same thing your fuel cut switch does. Putting oil in the engine helps build compression if it's been flooded.

MmSadda · 03-29-2011, 12:52 PM

I'll check the EGI fuse. -checked and all fuses with EGI in the title are fine.

Tach is making the tiniest of bounces once each time I start the ignition, then nothing.

**engine isn't flooded, there's practically no way an apex seal is blown, etc. - Fred's assumptions are all fair.

MmSadda · 03-29-2011, 12:53 PM

Where is the fuel pump check connector? Not coming up with that one easily in the Haynes manual

03-28-2011, 11:20 PM	#1
MmSadda BOOSTED COLON Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 88 Rep Power: 18	Recently rebuilt 2nd gen suddenly won't start - where to begin? Okay, here's the deal - I'm driving an S4 (87) n/a, stock for all practical purposes, got about 25k miles on a rebuilt engine, and at the same time got new fuel pump, new injectors, new ignition coils, etc. I drove the car two days ago, and it ran 100% normal. Tried to start it today, and it'll sit there and crank and crank but won't actually fire up so I think I'm either not getting fuel or not getting a spark. What's a good starting point as far as things to test? **I should note, the guy who rebuilt my engine installed a kill switch (pretty sure it's for the fuel injectors, in case the engine floods)

03-29-2011, 06:35 AM	#2
tweiss3 Mazda Lover Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Akron, Ohio Posts: 319 Rep Power: 16	Did you try "flood" starting it, put the pedal in the floor and crank it? See if it turns over then. __________________ 2004 Mazda6 V6 5-spd - still waiting on money for a motor 1991 Mazda RX7 NA 5-spd - my new DD with 145,000 miles

03-29-2011, 07:03 AM	#4
tweiss3 Mazda Lover Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Akron, Ohio Posts: 319 Rep Power: 16	Oops, works on my S5. I forgot. Pull the plugs and crank for 15 seconds, reinstall plugs and see if it starts up. __________________ 2004 Mazda6 V6 5-spd - still waiting on money for a motor 1991 Mazda RX7 NA 5-spd - my new DD with 145,000 miles

03-29-2011, 08:13 AM	#5
djmtsu My minds tellin' me no... Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Murfreesboro, TN Posts: 4,043 Rep Power: 22	Shouldn't the tach 'bounce' if it is getting spark? I forget. __________________ 1976 Mazda Cosmo RX-5 1976 Mazda Cosmo RX-5 2003 Toyota Tundra TRD 2015 Toyota 4Runner SR5

03-29-2011, 10:52 AM	#7
RXTASY idahorotary.com Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Idaho Posts: 135 Rep Power: 16	Pull the plug wires and put a screw driver to the tip of them and see if there is a spark arcing. If there is, pull your two leading plugs, and yer EGI fuse and turn it over and blow all the gas out of it. Squirt a little motor oil in there while yer at it. Try that. __________________ 87 TII-E85-600+ RWHP and climbing Life starts at 2 bar! Come visit my forum! idahorotary.com http://idahorotary.com/smf/index.php

03-29-2011, 11:20 AM	#10
FC Zach RCC Loves Me Not You Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Eagleville, TN Posts: 2,267 Rep Power: 20	I typically just leave a plug in the end of the wire and ground it, have a helping hand to turn it over, and while that is going on you can observe whether or not there is spark. Screwdriver works too, just a little cumbersome to me. __________________ 1993 Yamaha GTS1000 1992 Celica Turbo AllTrac 1987 RX7 Sport 1979 Yamaha G1, KM24 powered 1975 Dolmar KMS4

03-29-2011, 12:19 PM	#12
FRED Rotary Fan in Training Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 73 Rep Power: 15	Watch the tach needle while trying to start the engine. IF the needle makes small movements that tells you a lot. It tells you that the ENGINE fuse, both EGI fuse are all good and that the main relay is pulling in. Engine will not start with a blown EGI fuse(s), engine fuse, period. IF the needle does make movements try deflooding it by the usual methods. I assume you don't have a blown apex seal when saying this and you have gas in the tank and there is no fuel cut switch in the OFF position. EDIT: And or ...........put a jumper in the fuel pump check connector and the key put to ON. The fuel pump should be heard running. If not.......too bad, something is amiss. Last edited by FRED; 03-29-2011 at 12:21 PM.

03-29-2011, 12:52 PM	#14
MmSadda BOOSTED COLON Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 88 Rep Power: 18	I'll check the EGI fuse. -checked and all fuses with EGI in the title are fine. Tach is making the tiniest of bounces once each time I start the ignition, then nothing. **engine isn't flooded, there's practically no way an apex seal is blown, etc. - Fred's assumptions are all fair.

03-29-2011, 12:53 PM	#15
MmSadda BOOSTED COLON Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 88 Rep Power: 18	Where is the fuel pump check connector? Not coming up with that one easily in the Haynes manual