Where do I begin?

[parrotfever]

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3299/3595187889_7427f404c2.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3603/3595992890_728aa1d9ef.jpg

I brought her home new in '89, parked her in '93 with approx 130m miles (87m on odometer), and have left her sitting ever since...Where would you start?

I know the engine was smoking and had lost compression when last started. Body is good, but mice have partied under the hood and inside. The paint has crazed and chipped. I'm starting with a general cleaning and will pull the engine within the month. In the meantime, all advice, suggestions, and warnings will be greatly appreciated. My goal, initially, is to return to NA functionality. My eventual goal will be to gain what I can in HP w/o turbo - up to the convertible's ability to handle the stress.

I waited this long in order to gain 'classic' tags to reduce my insurance costs. With 3 driving age kids, I've come to realize that that was one of the stupidest ideas I ever had! Money's tight, but I want to do it right.

I'll post some more photos in an album today showing other perspectives of the car and its current home.

parrotfever Bob

[classicauto]

First thing I'd do is address the old fuel, try to fire it up and then assess the smoking.

Could (and likely does) need a rebuild, but you may as well sort out things it'll need to run (ie. gas, brakes, etc) before diving into the engine.

[need RX7]

Make sure those mice didn't chew up any of the wiring or anything. They can be assholes like that sometimes.

[Phoenix7]

Make sure those mice didn't chew up any of the wiring or anything. They can be assholes like that sometimes.:lol: asshole mice!!!

Gives a new meaning to getting rid of the rat's nest.

Can you go into detail about the "classic" tags please?

If the motor is dead then pull that out first and then start cleaning things up while it's getting rebuilt. I don't know what else to tell you since I have the same problem getting started....so much to do that it's overwhelming.

[RotaryRoadRage]

the motor had low compression in 93 ? trash that mofo , i'm sure it's eaten alive with rust inside..next would have to be the wiring..mice can tear shit up in less than a month , let alone over 10 year's.. the location look's prime too for a nation of them.. lol after that and some clean'n up , she should be ready for a transformation.. :) i would suggest doing some research to find out what kinda set up you're looking for.. myself , i'd go with a RE .. small streetport , a haltch and some e85 should bring her back to life.
that my 2 pennies.

chris

[Max777]

Nice, lol!

Look into getting a remanufactured engine. I would pull the old one apart just for kicks, but I would not expect it to be any good. I wish you good luck with this man, looks like fun!

[Phoenix7]

no way, go TII....plug and play...but he said no turbo.

[RotaryRoadRage]

ahhh.. yes , i see that now.. in that case.. do a NA 20B :)

[parrotfever]

Can you go into detail about the "classic" tags please?


in New Jersey any vehicle older than 25 years can be registered as antique, does not require vehicle inspection, and it's a one time fee of 55 bucks as long as you own it; the only time in your life that the State officials of N.J. won't bleed you for every penny you have left. Insurance cost is based upon your appraised valuation of the vehicle.

[djmtsu]

Nice white vert!

Just start taking things apart, buy or download the Service Manual (can be found here in the 2nd Gen FAQ).

Good luck!

[TitaniumTT]

CT is the same way with the 25 yr rule, I can't fucking wait. Especially considering the last emmisions "test" cost me a motor :banghead: Anywho, you're still 5 years away from classic status. Are you expecting this to take you 5 years?

What I would do.
1) Put the car on the lift so you can work a little easier.
2) Pull motor
3) Pull Fenders/front bumper
4) Pull suspension/brakes/rear subframe, rear LSD, fuel tank.
5) Inspect EVERYTHING. make sure the diff isn't rotten on the inside. Make sure the brakes move freely, fuel lines aren't rotten, wires chewed, etc etc etc.
6) Replace EVERYTHING that needs it, but not just one piece. If one rear brake cali is frozen, I would do both. one rear shock is gone, do both. Hell I would look into some "sport" replacements. Tockico, Eibach, KYB etc etc etc.
7) Crack the shortblock open and see what your looking at in terms of what needs replacement. It'll be obvious. If you're not planning on doing it yourself I would be in touch with a few local rebuilders to see what's what. I say local becuase if you don't know, you can actually bring the engine to them. For example, personally, I would recommend Dave @ KDR or Ihor @ IRP. You're actually closer to Dave than I am so don't complain about the drive. Take the block to him, ask what it would cost for a rebuild. If you're to squeeze the most HP out of the car as possible, than some porting would be in order. However, you could need new plates, housings, rotors etc etc etc. if it's too much, you can pick the motor up, drive to the nearest mazda dealershipand drop it off as a core for a reman. Last I looked a 13B-REW shortblock was $4000. Potentially cheaper than the rebuild depending on whats needed.
8) Reassemble.
9) Keep kids away
10) Enjoy

[parrotfever]

Many thanks to all for the time & interest/support! Hood came off this morning and so I begin. I'm photographing each move so I can remember where I'm at. As I dig in, I'll let you all know how it's shaping up. I definitely intend to dismantle/rebuild all systems but was curious as to where to start.

I'm guessing that I'm older than most (all?) of you in years but a baby in rotary knowledge. I'll welcome everyone's advice each step of the way. Time? With 1 in college, 1 starting in the fall, and 1 two years behind, it COULD take 5 years...I hope not! Bottom line is, my RX is the last remaining memory of my 'middle' single life & I'm determined to save her.

Having read the turbo suggestions, I'm curious. Opinion at the time of purchase was that the convertible wouldn't stand up to the stresses involved. I see many of you taking these engines into the HP stratosphere! What have you'all learned that I would like to know?

[djmtsu]

There are plenty of turbo verts running around, some with ridiculous power. The can take it. Fero313 is nearly done with his turbo vert, it is an easy swap.

And remember, in Japan the turbo was the only way you could get a vert!

[TitaniumTT]

I'm guessing that I'm older than most (all?) of you in years but a baby in rotary knowledge.

:rofl: I'm 30 and these kids ;) consider me an old man...

I'll welcome everyone's advice each step of the way. Time? With 1 in college, 1 starting in the fall, and 1 two years behind, it COULD take 5 years...I hope not! Bottom line is, my RX is the last remaining memory of my 'middle' single life & I'm determined to save her.

Yeah I know what that's about, believe me. Don't sell her no matter what. She can hang on the back burner as mine did for a while, but never give in.

Having read the turbo suggestions, I'm curious. Opinion at the time of purchase was that the convertible wouldn't stand up to the stresses involved. I see many of you taking these engines into the HP stratosphere! What have you'all learned that I would like to know?

As mentioned above, overseas the only way one could get a vert was turbo. The chassis is plenty strong enough for it. Think about all the e-prod verts running around. Granted they have integral cages but still. You could stiffen her up if you needed to.

However, A TII drivetrain with a few simple bolt-ons will net more power than the wildest N/A rotary. So if you want a platform to build from, I would seriously consider dropping in a TII drivetrain. It's basically plug and play which is even better. No real additional time over what you'll be investing into this PJ as it is.

[Max777]

Did you have any solid basis for the opinion that "the vert wouldn't hold up to the stresses involved with turbocharging" or what? It just sound like such a load of baloney to me if you know what I mean... like something a salesman would tell you in order to get you to buy the turbo model or something... where did this wildly inacurate hypothesis come from and what was it based on?



I really want to know. :D

[Rx-7fetish]

Someone may have told him that the n/a drivetrain would not hold up to a turbo motor. Which in most cases they would be right. Then maybe he misunderstood that for the chassis wont handle it. But if he is getting a turbo motor then it shouldnt be to hard to source a drivetrain too. Being as he wants to modify it, that would be a good idea to do anyways.

[djmtsu]

Back when the FC verts came out buyers were like 'Where's the boost?'

Mazda did not want to import the turbo verts here, so salesman claimed the chassis was too flimsy.

Comprende?

[Phoenix7]

does being old at heart count?

I'm sure you're talking about the NA tranny/rear end not holdig up to the increased power. The Europeans and Japanese got Turbo Verts but they had the beefier turbo drivetrain as well.

Your best bet is to find a crashed turbo (same year range as yours for plug-and-play) and do a complete swap. You can rock a 250hp stock-ish setup and have a blast without breaking the bank.

Or you can just take it easy for a while and do reliability/handling mods to the non-turbo: radiator, intake, exhaust, suspension, wheels....just leave the power for last. Whatever route you take, you'll be happy with the 7...Just remember to maintain it like a 3rd child/2nd wife. :lol:

[parrotfever]

Back when the FC verts came out buyers were like 'Where's the boost?'

Mazda did not want to import the turbo verts here, so salesman claimed the chassis was too flimsy.

Comprende?

Dead On accurate! I was given the choice of sun or power. At the time, 'turbo-lag' and top-RPM limiters were the other non-turbo (NA) sellers for me. I chose the sun & wrapping the tach around to zero before shifting.

At this point, I'm up to removal of the interior to access the engine cable in the 'engine removal' guide. Put power to the top & lowered it today in order to Spray Nine the whole damn interior. Mold & dead mice headed out before I get under the dash again. Felt good to see the dash light up like a Christmas tree! I think the harnesses may have survived. All of a sudden, my 16 year old sees a reason to join in. I think he's looking ahead (are those really speakers in the seat headrests?!?).

parrotfever Bob

[Phoenix7]

ah, i forgot you bought the car ages ago...and yes they are speakers.

[parrotfever]

...and yes they are speakers.


That was the kid. I guess he didn't know we did have music before his gen. Though to be honest, at the time of purchase I had no idea what a CD was!

parrotfever Bob

[My5ABaby]

Though to be honest, at the time of purchase I had no idea what a CD was!

parrotfever Bob
Ironically, at this point you have no need for them. Ipod hookup > CDs.

[Phoenix7]

crazy, I've never seen anything older than a cassette...BTW, if that's a lift in your garage then you are the man...it'll make working on the car so much easier.

[Justen]

...but i hear you can only put so many miles on the car per year. and no racing under that insurance policy because of the higher possibilty of damaging the vehicle. plus cops in jersey are strict when it comes to antiques/classic plates. they'll pull you over to make sure youre either going to a car show, a meet, or a shop etc.

[Justen]

and i agree, i would kill for a lift like that

[parrotfever]

...but i hear you can only put so many miles on the car per year. and no racing under that insurance policy because of the higher possibilty of damaging the vehicle. plus cops in jersey are strict when it comes to antiques/classic plates. they'll pull you over to make sure youre either going to a car show, a meet, or a shop etc.

"General inspections are not required for historic or collector vehicles. To be classified as a "historic vehicle" it must be:
At least 25 years old
Specially registered and display QQ plates (1945 and earlier models are required to display one plate on the rear of the vehicle. 1946 and newer models will be issued two plates and both plates must be displayed, one on the front and one on the back of the vehicle).

You can purchase historic plates for $44. To be considered a historic vehicle, the vehicle has to be at least 25 years old and only used for exhibition and educational purposes by the owner." NJ DMV website


You may be thinking of 'Collector' plates which have a 3,000 mile annual limit. And what could be more educational than driving around on a nice sunny day! I know a lot of 'QQ' plates that go to work every day.

Originally Posted by Phoenix 7 - crazy, I've never seen anything older than a cassette...

OK, so my first computer was an Apple with a serial number of 773. And, yeah, the lift is cool but not a place to park a long-term project. The RX-7 will remain on jack stands for the forseeable future. I'm at the point of recognizing that, in order to remove the carpeting without cutting, the dashboard has to come out (suggestions anyone?). Dog bless digital cameras.

parrotfever Bob

[jimmy_trader]

1) I wish Hawaii had Classic/Antique tags.
2) Is that a '69 Camaro in picture 2?
3) If a TII swap is so "Plug and Play", does anybody feel like coming over to "Plug" an S5 TII Engine, Transmission, Starter, Drive Shaft, Rear End w/half-shafts, an FMIC (so I can keep my hood) a Turbo ECU, and Complete Wire Harness in my Vert so I can "Play" too?

Congratulations on bringing her back to life. Since you've already begun, I'll wish you all the best. If you have the Owners Manual, it lists everything for a 60,000 mile tune up. Mostly fluids, but well worth the effort.
I think deciding what to do will probably be harder for you than actually doing it.

Restore to original condition.
Turbo swap.
Porting.
Stand-alone EMS (Engine Management System)
Something in-between.

Supercharger is another option, but most of what I've read leads me to believe that you just don't get the HP/$ results that a TII gives.

All have pros and cons.
If you're looking for N/A power, the easiest quick fixes are intake and exahust. Open her up so she can breath. Both in and out. I don't know about NJ exahust rules, but if you can replace the stock system, do it. Keep in mind the S5 used back pressure for the 5th & 6th port actuators.
If you stick with the N/A you can get a rebuild kit and do it yourself. Maybe a great project for the 16yr old. There are wonderful write-ups with pictures on rebuilds and what to look for. I Think there's a video too. Or, like was mentioned earlier, take the block to somone and have them do it for you.
Turbo engines are available on eBay and elsewhere. Forum Classifieds are a great source.
If you go that route, I recommend all that stuff I mentioned in #3. The Turbo Transmission is more robust, and the rear diff is an LSD. You can go TII trans to N/A diff and Mazdatrix sells a driveshaft for that application. Personally, I'd want the LSD and in fact, if I can get a TII trans, starter, shaft, and diff, I may put that in there with my N/A.
Nah, forget that; I want the Turbo motor, drive train, S5 lip and side skirts, so I guess I need a donor TII.
If you decide to buy an engine, get the compression numbers for all three faces of both rotors. You don't want to buy an engine only to find out that that one needs a rebuild too. Well, not at full price anyway.
Best of luck, keep us posted, and welcome (back) to the toppless club.
Aloha,
~j

[parrotfever]

1) I wish Hawaii had Classic/Antique tags.

I'll trade NJ's classic tags for your weather any day!

2) Is that a '69 Camaro in picture 2?.

A friend's '72 'vette.

3) If a TII swap is so "Plug and Play", does anybody feel like coming over to "Plug" an S5 TII Engine, Transmission, Starter, Drive Shaft, Rear End w/half-shafts, an FMIC (so I can keep my hood) a Turbo ECU, and Complete Wire Harness in my Vert so I can "Play" too?.

Amen to that! But it sounds like your well on your way. I don't see getting past the emissions czars in NJ if I turbo, which is a reason to stay NA until she's 25. We may have classic tags, but we've also got State inspectors to keep us toeing the line!

parrotfever Bob

[jimmy_trader]

1) We get 120" of rain here per year. But yeah, I'm not moving back to Bucks County, PA anytime soon. (I do miss cheesesteaks enough to visit pretty often though.)
2) Ahhh. Vert?
3) No (official) emissions check on Hawaii Island. :)

[Phoenix7]

3) If a TII swap is so "Plug and Play", does anybody feel like coming over to "Plug" an S5 TII Engine, Transmission, Starter, Drive Shaft, Rear End w/half-shafts, an FMIC (so I can keep my hood) a Turbo ECU, and Complete Wire Harness in my Vert so I can "Play" too?.lol, it IS plug and play, once you put everything in place you plug it all in and it WILL turn over, no wiring at all. It's a bitch but if I can do it with crappy tools then anyone can do it. I literally did everything you mentioned and I'm working on the new ECU.

Amen to that! But it sounds like your well on your way. I don't see getting past the emissions czars in NJ if I turbo, which is a reason to stay NA until she's 25. We may have classic tags, but we've also got State inspectors to keep us toeing the line!
stock TII motor with stock exhaust will pass smog all day. Just drive home, swap out exhaust and enjoy a fun TII vert. Just do it, you know you want to.

[Starlybags]

hi, i would like to know how long a life expectancy a 12a stock 1981 S1 rx7 would have? some one was saying its only 100,000km. can anyone help? churs

[Rx-7fetish]

hi, i would like to know how long a life expectancy a 12a stock 1981 S1 rx7 would have? some one was saying its only 100,000km. can anyone help? churs

Your in the wrong section first off, try the first gen section, the life will depend on the maintanance of the motor, just keep up with oil changes and such







To the op, hows the car doin? made any progress on what you decided to do with it?

[Phoenix7]

hi, i would like to know how long a life expectancy a 12a stock 1981 S1 rx7 would have? some one was saying its only 100,000km. can anyone help? churs100K miles to 300K miles depending on maintenance and care. With a car that old you're better off checking compression and preparing for a rebuild, you don't know hoe the previous owners maintained it. BTW you're in teh wrong section.

[parrotfever]

To the op, hows the car doin? made any progress on what you decided to do with it?


Strip down is moving along - more slowly over the past week as I tore my triceps tendons. Looks like the only mouse wire damage to date involves the stereo connections - no biggy. Right now I'm watching SHPmainMAN's TII raffle to see if it will go! If wishes add horses, I'll turbo yet. Many thanks for asking.

parrotfever Bob

[Rx-7fetish]

Nice, i actually have a spare s4 t2 motor with none of the bolt on stuff, its just the block, that i might be interested in selling. I bought an 88 t2 with motor out for 600, motor seems to have good compression by ear, havent used a tool (dont have one) i was told it ran good when it was in car but was pulled to paint engine bay. I was planning on putting all that back together but came across a deal i couldnt pass up. I snagged a 10th ann running for 900 bucks!:icon_tup: My dad is thinking about fixing up the t2 but if he doesnt end up wanting it im gonna part it out. the only part of the drivetrain its missing is the driveshaft.