CDI ignition wiring help.

[Prodigy]

I am about to start wiring in my CDI ignition system completely replacing the factory system. Heres my questions in easy to read point form

Its a complete M&W system (Pro-14 rotary, and CDI coils)

Looking for some guidance...


-wiring type (I know higher quality is always better) what if i cannot find something local for a even reasonable price.
- wiring shielding do any of the wires need to be shielded? The signal wires from ECU? The +/- going to reach coil?
- Can I completely disconnect & remove all of the related stock components? (The ignitor etc)
-would it be better to cut the factory wiring engine harness, and just run all new wires for the trigger ECU-> CDI box

I think that's it for now...

Thanks for help


J.

[JL1RX7]

General wiring tips.

1. Don't go cheap. Spend the money on high grade stuff. Don't buy KAPTON period. It dries out and lets the magic smoke out.

2. Shield signal wires and don't run high power near them. Getting induced voltage on signal lines isn't fun.

3. Decide what you want/need in your harness and build your own. Hacking into a 20 year old plus harness isn't worth the time or trouble. Depinning and reusing connectors is fine.

4. Expect to spend crazy amount of time on it.

5. Make your out wiring diagram and label every wire. When close to done run continuity checks on each wire.

6. Check everything at least 56699 times. And you will still cross wires.

[GySgtFrank]

easy way? Call Chris Ludwig and have him build you a harness. It will be done right with professional wiring and ends, no screwing around with hokey connections and improperly shielded wires. It may seem like it costs a bit up front, but by the time you chase all the materials and tools down you will have spent more. <my opinion>

[FC Zach]

Agreed!

I don't have anywhere near a complex set-up but I justified having my harness built by Ludwig. Especially considering the costs for materials and tools like $300 and up crimpers that I may only use a couple times.

[RICE RACING]

Originally Posted by Prodigy

I am about to start wiring in my CDI ignition system completely replacing the factory system. Heres my questions in easy to read point form

Its a complete M&W system (Pro-14 rotary, and CDI coils)

Looking for some guidance...


-wiring type (I know higher quality is always better) what if i cannot find something local for a even reasonable price.
- wiring shielding do any of the wires need to be shielded? The signal wires from ECU? The +/- going to reach coil?
- Can I completely disconnect & remove all of the related stock components? (The ignitor etc)
-would it be better to cut the factory wiring engine harness, and just run all new wires for the trigger ECU-> CDI box

I think that's it for now...

Thanks for help


J.

I love pro harnesses, but are they needed? my view is no.

Here is an example of doing up a pretty simple adaption harness that plugged into the normal loom on a FD3S.

None of this is hard, but if you dont have the correct crimpers and plugs (DT series minimum) then you are pretty much wasting your time and better to leave it to a 'professional' Same if you cant read a wiring diagram or fault find.

In this below instal for example there was a factory printing fault for one wire in the harness from Dynatek! this does happen and you need to be on it to find these kinds of errors and they do and can happen, if you will be making mistakes of your own due to lack of attention or poor equipment in construction then please get someone else to make it for you.

Pics.

Bit of background for people, I developed COP systems for the 13B-REW many years ago, field proven, this is one of my old systems below (CDI set up)

[RICE RACING]

For a coil on Plug set up I highly recommend doing the front and rear rotor as modular units with opposing plugs, you can see the detail above.

I would on the M&W CDI coil NOT use the BS connector and would pot in (and add shrink boot) the three wires you need into a 6 way DT series plug for each rotors T&L coil, this then would be a quick connect/disconnect and be much more reliable than the OE shitty plug on the coil, and you will never mix them up.

One bolt and one plug disconnect and off it comes, easy simple, un fuckable.

[Prodigy]

Great Idea Rice with the modular, that was kinda my plan, then do just like you did with the 2 connectirs on your old dyna setup, wire the connectors so on the coil side one is femaleone is male, no way to screw it up then

What do you mean by 'pot in'
Like solder the wire to the plug then fill the whole plug area with silicone or something?

I found these chinese version of the Deutsch HDT-48-00 crimpers, I'm guessing not nearly as good, but under half the price its tempting... then I could purchase a nig connector 'kit' with a few of everything in it. The cheaper $50 one only do certain sizes of wire, so i would prefer to just get one size fits all crimpers.

If anyone knows domething selling a old pair of those crimpers I would be very interested in getting a set. Ild well taken care of tools work awesome lots of the time vs newer chinese stuff.

http://r.ebay.com/xHU6Lu


Should I just put in an order from prowireusa to grab a bunch of wire?

I want to make it so I leave the factory wiring completely untouched (try to not cut it up, maybe just depin a few) but have it completely reversible. So use a new male connector 4-pin for coil harness so I don't hack it up, then adapt it to be the trigger from ecu - pro 14. If I could find new ecu pins though, I would prefer to depin coil triggers from ecu and run 4 new independent wires.

@ keeping away from power wires etc, yes, and if you have to cross it, do it as close to a 90* cross as pissible.

I would describe myself as competent with wiring, mainly its high quality tools/materials because they cost so much up front.

Im no pro, but I beileve I can do a good job, just won't be *as* good.

Forgot to mention I can get *Real* Mil-Spec wire, local business brings it up from the US, only bad thing is $1/1ft...


J.

[RICE RACING]

https://www.rbracing-rsr.com/wiring_ecu.html

You will see Epoxy here and what I was talking about, this is a mate of mine, if you have a keen eye you will see my old Pectel set up on this page too.

Bob is a top bloke.

> This one here shows potting and boots to make a piece of shit connection into something that will work, I highly recommend doing this for the M&W coil end, cause you will be changing spark plugs often on a Rotary. No need to use the Motorsport connectors, just DT ones I showed in my old CDI set up, these cunts are tough as and can be pulled apart a jizzilion times without failure or issues.
Link > https://www.rbracing-rsr.com/sq6wiringloom.html

[Prodigy]

Originally Posted by RICE RACING

I would on the M&W CDI coil NOT use the BS connector and would pot in (and add shrink boot) the three wires you need

Im looking for clarification on one thing here, how should I connect the wire to the coil make pin, before I pot it?

What connection would you suggest making to be permanently 'potted' in place

I'm thinking of using the supplied SOCKET only, crimping to wire, placing onto the coil male pin, then potting it in.

Again, thank you guys for helping this newbie out...


J.

[C. Ludwig]

You can use the connector terminals, like you're suggesting. They'll fit snuggly until the potting compound sets up. Make sure you setup a proper boot, as shown in the images. This will provide strain relief. Without that, the wires will get broken off at the sensor pretty quickly.

Not sure whyPeter has an issue with the Metripack connector in the first place and is suggesting such a "fix". Other than being pull-to-seat, which is more difficult to work with, there is nothing inherently wrong with the connectors. They're OE quality and will provide good service for as long as you're going to use them. My guess is, whatever you choose to use on the pigtail extension you plan to make will be of no greater quality than what's already setup to use out of the box.

[RICE RACING]

Originally Posted by C. Ludwig

You can use the connector terminals, like you're suggesting. They'll fit snuggly until the potting compound sets up. Make sure you setup a proper boot, as shown in the images. This will provide strain relief. Without that, the wires will get broken off at the sensor pretty quickly.

Not sure whyPeter has an issue with the Metripack connector in the first place and is suggesting such a "fix". Other than being pull-to-seat, which is more difficult to work with, there is nothing inherently wrong with the connectors. They're OE quality and will provide good service for as long as you're going to use them. My guess is, whatever you choose to use on the pigtail extension you plan to make will be of no greater quality than what's already setup to use out of the box.

These specific coils, for COP application they are a royal pain in the arse, as in wrong position and not modular. You have nearly no room to the knock sensor on the Trailing coil for example and the Leading coil its hard to access the connector, thus reasons.

Best is to fuck them off and rewire per rotor pair so they cannot be confused, bit of work but makes for much simpler thing to work on and more reliable too.

[C. Ludwig]

OK. I understand the space limitation. Since the OP is potting and booting, would be a good application for a 90° boot. Joe at Prowire will hook you up.

[RICE RACING]

Originally Posted by C. Ludwig

OK. I understand the space limitation. Since the OP is potting and booting, would be a good application for a 90° boot. Joe at Prowire will hook you up.

I'll have to look him up as I need to do a couple of kits here too as well as my own, thanks.

[Prodigy]

Started the wiring, about to pot in, going to get other sides pins/wires ready first, then pot them all in @ once with epoxy.

The middle wire on the coils is the positive lead, so i chose to cover it with some shrink incase shit gets bumped hard and touches its neighbour...

That cable is 5 wire w/shield. It is used in the oil/gas industry as outside data cable, regularly left on the ground/mud/ice whatever in +35 to - 45 *c temp range, told the guy the power i need to run through it, he said itll be perfect for that, and stays flexible down to -50 i think he said, and petroleum products resistant, so perfect for a 7's engine bay. One of the 5 strand is the ground, I'm using that as the 'block ground' for the coils, and attaching both coils with 1 lead to block gnd.

Going decent, constructivecriticism more then welcome, this is my first time doing wiring this important from sratch.

M&W CDI module will be mounted where factory ignitor was, fits perfectly on a bit of an angle hopefully I'll have this back up & running by tomorrow. Even though Im heading out of town tonight.

I dont have any slick 90* boots as Chris was suggesting (cannot find anything close locally) so I'm using 4:1 shrink and going to try and be a bit *creative* when I shrink it. The ends of the coils where the clip goes on are shaved down another 1/2 inch to gain more space with the knock sensor/less angle for it to turn

Enough chat, pics attached below


J.

[RICE RACING]

I think it looks good.