Re-chromed rotor housings

[Ian]

+1. I myself have at least 6 housings. And three running performing engines that hopefully will not need "The process"

Thanks glassman for putting up the research.

Looking forward to seeing the results....

[glassman]

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

A) The beta tester that has the engine through Pineapple not relinquishing the engine for a few days for a tear down, that's total BS. Even with no written agreement, he should have some conscience about him to give it up to let it be tore down. I'm sure he got a killer deal on the engine so I'm actually a little pissed that he's not sharing results.

Actually I'm not surprised at all. Every single time I've requested data for one reason or another from anyone in the last 11 yrs I've never once got anything at all from anyone in the form of concrete data.

Having said that, please understand the guy is a customer who wanted a re-build, he paid full price for this engine and agreed to have it in his car because Rob gave him a smokin warranty for doing it. No loss to him if it goes wrong. It's the guy's commuter to and from work so we get some good mileage there but he cannot be without it at this point. Don't worry, we'll get a look through the exhaust ports and eventually it will come apart for all to see.

Actually only one of the housings in his engine has the re-chrome, Rob built a seperate engine with the other housing we had. Basically we wanted a starting point as fast as possible and this was the best opportunity to make that happen. In the long run it will pay off because we get some high miles, I believe the engine has been running for 3+ yrs

[NoDOHC]

Want to do another pilot? How about several others?

As long as the price is fair (about 1/2 a new housing plus shipping) - I will be glad to provide you with 2 housings to be re-chromed. Even if they fail prematurely, I don't mind - they are nothing but scrap right now and it only takes a weekend day to remove, rebuild and reinstall an engine.

If I get 3 years on them, they should have 40,000 ish miles. My '86 is my daily driver for 8 months out of the year. I for one wouldn't mind tearing the engine down to get pictures. (I have done it before).

[glassman]

Yea sure, I'll try and talk with my guy tomorrow and nail down some prices for a small run of housings.

I'll let you know asap FD housings would likely see the most benefit in the way of savings if you have any of them.

I know prices are going up here substantially on all factory parts. What is the situation there on that? How much for a new housing?

[speedjunkie]

I'd be down to be a tester as well. And I'm rebuilding my engine now so it would be PERFECT haha. I'm really hoping you guys offer this as a service, sooner rather than later would be best but if you end up offering it at all I'd be super happy.

[glassman]

I'll be going to see my guy within the hour and we'll get this moving along.
I'll post back here with the details

[glassman]

I'm just working out the details and will post soon on what I've come up with.

I do believe you will be happy!

[speedjunkie]

So there is a chance I can do this too? If so, would I be sending my housings or getting some that are already done?

[glassman]

Ok, here's the skinny.

Taking into account those who want to participate we've had to consider a few things.
#1 your participation is worth something to us.
#2 potential of actually getting data back from participants
#3 a minimum # of housings needed to proceed
#4 liability

1) We feel that anyone’s involvement should come with some kind of recompense so we've decided to offer them below what our goal is of half of new. New being based on what the average shop would pay for them. Even with the cost being much higher without being set-up for production. This would be your recompense.

2) We realise that we may not get all the kind of data we want from this. My experience tells me that no matter what is promised; seldom do people actually come through with details. So this still leaves an area that needs to be resolved. I see 2 options for this. The first option is to settle for what ever people want to offer for data and let it go at that. Obviously this would be less desirable for us but then there are no expectations on either party. The other option is to charge an additional $100 per housing which would be reimbursed upon receiving proper data. This way we are more assured to get what we want from this. Option 2 would likely come with some other benefits in the way of first dibs and/or perhaps special pricing on initial order or over a period of time. It would likely include options for testing other developments we have cooking in the future.

3) We need a minimum of 12 housings to proceed, more than that is ok too.

4) Participants would need to sign a waiver for all liability including; loss, damage, injury etc. This has never been done so we will NOT be responsible for any expected or imagined result. Having said that our ultimate goal is to make this work and you are an integral part of that. We will do everything we can to ensure your success with them including offering any technical support necessary.

Now the good part

Re-chrome Price = $250 per housing Canadian Dollars (special price as your recompense)
Data deposit = $100 per housing US Dollars (this will be paid to Pineapple Racing for ease of reimbursement, no exchange rates to worry about)
Shipping Return = $50 Canadian Dollars for 2 housings and $32 for 1 housing
Shipped in a factory housing box.

I've contacted USPS to get an extimate on your cost to ship to Canada and I was surprised that Canada Post was cheaper to return than USPS is to get them here. That's a first! Anyway the shipping cost by USPS Priority Mail International in a factory box is $73.00 USD for 2 housings.

I asked about the flat rate box and they tell me if you can fit it in the box and close it they will take it. Medium Flat Rate Box is 13-5/8" X 11-7/8" X 3-3/8" for $27.95 USD. The rotor housing is 13" X 12-5/8" X 3-1/8" approx so it would be close with the studs removed and placed seperately in the box. Otherwise the large is $35 USD. Can someone check if they can fit the housing in one?? I think if you bump the sides in a bit it might go in. The post office here say's they will ship back in the same box as long as we cover up the USPS markings.

So if we add it all up based on a pair of housings we get;

$500 CDN + $50 CDN = $550 CDN
plus
$200 USD + $73 USD = $273 USD

The $200 is kept in trust with Pineapple for reimbursement so that leaves the $73 USD you would have to pay to get them here.

Based on today's exchange rate $550 CDN is about $570 USD.

So if you look at it from there your cost is approx $570 + $73 = $643 USD per pair not counting the data deposit. I didn't count it here because you WILL give us the data and get the $200 back
The amount will vary a little on the $CDN conversion due to daily exchange variences. You will be given an amount the day of your payment for best accuracy. The cost will also come down by $18 USD if the med flat rate box can be used.

I hope you see this as not only an excellent value but an excellent opportunity to be a part of something this exciting and rewarding!

[TitaniumTT]

Very interesting..... Depending on how quickly they can be re-chromed I will be on it for an n/a ported rebuild in my mothers 'vert, I have a set of housings now that would be perfect candidates for Goopy's machining, but I'm willing to use her car/housings as the ginuea pig for my FD build.... comments will result in ban

I think what needs be be made expressly clear is what kind of data you want back. I'm thinking if it can be done soon and I can get the car running around May or June with these housings, we'll have 5-6 months worth of driving and next winter I'll haul the engine and break it apart. Based on my own previous personal experiences, all I would need is an o-ring kit to reassemble the engine. Do to the tightness that I clearance my engines at, my last one after 10k and 100+ dyno pulls still spec'ed out below Mazda's min's. No seals needed, just the o-rings. People should be made aware that if they build an engine properly and care for it properly, this should be the norm, I'm not an engine building genius by any means.

Now I understand that the $200 refund is a good incentive, but maybe consider tossing in Pineapples o-ring kit to reassemble the engine after it's been broken apart? I think this will give people more of an incentive to haul an engine, open it up, and get more data as opposed to just looking inside the exhaust ports. Just my suggestion.

What type of seals do you reccomend using? This being an n/a engine I would prob go with the RA classics. The turbo engine I plan on building will be RA Super Seals. I've noticed MINIMAL chatter marks after years of use, I run pre-mix though, so other results may vary.

What types of housings are you looking for? The ones that I felt were excellent candidates for the re-surfacing were S4 n/a housings. I've got a few pairs of these that are door stops, or worn beyond the limits of the re-surfacing. I've also got one REW housing that is in good shape, minor flaking, and one REW housing that ate an Apex Seal as is destroyed. Would it be good to use these housings for this process? Would it be better to use the S4 N/A housings that are just plain worn out for this process? If there is a difference in housings, can you please explain what they are and why some are better than others? Basically what I don't want to do is use my REW housings for the 'Vert build and then need to sacrifice a little or source busted REW housings when i go to assembly the FD where I'll be looking for 3x the power of the 'Vert.

Approx turn around time?

Thanks so much for this.

-Brian

Oh, and I have to ask, are you still active on 7club posting up about this or were you shunned for not paying vendor fees?

[NoDOHC]

I'm with TTT, exactly what are you looking for data wise?

Do you want the housings sent to you?

Is it ok to disassemble the engine, take four pictures per housing (oil injector, exhaust port, compression area + Trailing plug, hole leading plug hole + expansion area) and post them here?

Do you want a glowing write-up, measurements, etc.?

The housing price seems realistic, the data deposit seems rather low to expect anyone to actually remove and disassemble their engine. Maybe compression readings would be sufficient?

I am willing to pull the engine, disassemble it and take pictures for posterity and the sake of research (no money involved), but I wouldn't disassemble it for $200.00, it would cost me almost that much in gaskets and seals.

[TitaniumTT]

Originally Posted by NoDOHC

I'm with TTT, exactly what are you looking for data wise?

Do you want the housings sent to you?

Is it ok to disassemble the engine, take four pictures per housing (oil injector, exhaust port, compression area + Trailing plug, hole leading plug hole + expansion area) and post them here?

Do you want a glowing write-up, measurements, etc.?

The housing price seems realistic, the data deposit seems rather low to expect anyone to actually remove and disassemble their engine. Maybe compression readings would be sufficient?

I am willing to pull the engine, disassemble it and take pictures for posterity and the sake of research (no money involved), but I wouldn't disassemble it for $200.00, it would cost me almost that much in gaskets and seals.

That's the blunt way of making my point

[glassman]

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

I think what needs be be made expressly clear is what kind of data you want back. I'm thinking if it can be done soon and I can get the car running around May or June with these housings, we'll have 5-6 months worth of driving and next winter I'll haul the engine and break it apart. Based on my own previous personal experiences, all I would need is an o-ring kit to reassemble the engine. Do to the tightness that I clearance my engines at, my last one after 10k and 100+ dyno pulls still spec'ed out below Mazda's min's. No seals needed, just the o-rings. People should be made aware that if they build an engine properly and care for it properly, this should be the norm, I'm not an engine building genius by any means.

Now I understand that the $200 refund is a good incentive, but maybe consider tossing in Pineapples o-ring kit to reassemble the engine after it's been broken apart? I think this will give people more of an incentive to haul an engine, open it up, and get more data as opposed to just looking inside the exhaust ports. Just my suggestion.

The kind of data we want would include: Porting, N/A or turbo, as much details of the build as possible, supporting hardware, HP figures, mileage, comp tests, apex seal clearances, premix and anything else you can think of that I'm missing.

I will ask Rob about that.

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

What type of seals do you reccomend using? This being an n/a engine I would prob go with the RA classics. The turbo engine I plan on building will be RA Super Seals. I've noticed MINIMAL chatter marks after years of use, I run pre-mix though, so other results may vary.

Ideally factory seals, there is a massive amount of data on them as far as wear patterns, expected life etc. Although I guess they will have to work with other seals too, at least as good as they do now on factory plated housings.

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

What types of housings are you looking for? The ones that I felt were excellent candidates for the re-surfacing were S4 n/a housings. I've got a few pairs of these that are door stops, or worn beyond the limits of the re-surfacing. I've also got one REW housing that is in good shape, minor flaking, and one REW housing that ate an Apex Seal as is destroyed. Would it be good to use these housings for this process? Would it be better to use the S4 N/A housings that are just plain worn out for this process? If there is a difference in housings, can you please explain what they are and why some are better than others? Basically what I don't want to do is use my REW housings for the 'Vert build and then need to sacrifice a little or source busted REW housings when i go to assembly the FD where I'll be looking for 3x the power of the 'Vert.

It doesn't matter the series of the housing. What is imortant is the condition of the steel insert. Whatever is supplied is the quality of surface you can expect. If the housing chrome is just worn or has scratches that are not into the insert they will be just like new. If there is chrome peeling and the insert is pitted or gouged this will translate into the chrome. So basically look at the housing and imagine if the chrome were removed would the insert have any marks, gouges or pitting. Later on we will be looking into repairing the steel insert to salvage any housing.

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

Approx turn around time?

I will be checking on this for your answer.

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

Oh, and I have to ask, are you still active on 7club posting up about this or were you shunned for not paying vendor fees?

I started a thread on there but we'll see how long that lasts.

[glassman]

Originally Posted by NoDOHC

Do you want the housings sent to you?

Yes

Originally Posted by NoDOHC

Is it ok to disassemble the engine, take four pictures per housing (oil injector, exhaust port, compression area + Trailing plug, hole leading plug hole + expansion area) and post them here?

Do you want a glowing write-up, measurements, etc.?

In addition to some of the specs in my last post yes those pictures would be perfect. I don't know that all measurements are needed as long as they are within factory specs. A lot of the clearances simply do not apply to how the housing chrome stands up. I guess if binding corner seals were a problem that would affect the result.

Originally Posted by NoDOHC

The housing price seems realistic, the data deposit seems rather low to expect anyone to actually remove and disassemble their engine. Maybe compression readings would be sufficient?

Yes at first they would be sufficient but at some point the engine would have to come down for a look.

Originally Posted by NoDOHC

I am willing to pull the engine, disassemble it and take pictures for posterity and the sake of research (no money involved), but I wouldn't disassemble it for $200.00, it would cost me almost that much in gaskets and seals.

You don't have to tear it down but then we keep the $200 data deposit.
Maybe we are getting ahead of ourselves. I wouldn't expect you to tear it down right away anyhow. The longer together the better as long is everything is working properly.

[Ian]

I have housings that have apex seal damage. Almost all of them have corner triangle chrome flake? I thought the purpose of rechroming was to get this fixed? So the quality of this rechroming only reflects the quality of the housings to begin with? Is there going to be pictures of acceptable housings vs unacceptable?

For me I would want to try my worst set But I have two new engines sitting in my cars now so hopefully no need for new housings right this year Mind you the track is pretty rough.....