Joff and MrsJoff's Chaste White BorgWarner FD build

RCCAZ 1 · 12-23-2010, 09:24 AM

Looking awesome Jesse. Nice work. Where did you get that turbo blanket? Really fits nicely!! Keep it coming and let me know if you need help. I'm off now until the new year!

joff · 12-23-2010, 11:41 AM

Thanks for the heads up guys -- a while ago I did a little research on this and did see a thread somewhere where some of the white plastic phenolic gaskets had warped.

The gasket I have is from gizzmo and is definitely from a different material. I'd guess its something like the FR44 material we use for manufacturing circuit boards.

Is this the EGR port you were talking about?

It seems to cover it -- maybe by not much margin. I'll probably see about plugging that EGR hole with some aluminum or JBweld.

The turbo blanket I think I got from ebay. Its pretty thin actually, but that works for me because I'm a little worried about too much heat in the turbo. I painted it with the same 1500degF silicone sealant paint I painted the header wrap with.

Thanks Tim, I'd take you up on some help this week if it weren't for the fact we'll be in Tucson visiting family.

speedjunkie · 12-23-2010, 10:43 PM

Yep, that is the exact same gasket I have with the exact same specs, not completely covering the exact same EGR port LOL. I guess if you cover it with JB Weld or something that would work too. Good luck with all that. Just wanted to give you a heads up so you didn't get it together and then try to figure out where the leak was coming from LOL.

Mine looked the same btw. It looked like it was covering, but air still came out of there.

Prodigy · 12-24-2010, 12:12 AM

That last photo you can see a tiny little bit of the EGR port sticking out... I can see why that would warp and let create a leak....

interesting though that they make them out the same, or similar material as circuit boards...

J.

speedjunkie · 12-24-2010, 01:26 AM

^I don't think these are the ones that warp, I honestly think these might have a good chance of standing up to the heat. That little bit of the EGR port is enough to leak enough air to make it sound like a motorcycle. So it's already bad just the way it is, it doesn't take warping to make it sound like crap haha. And the ones the other guys on 7club had were made by a different company I believe. So far no one that has had a Gizzmo one (that I know of) has had it warp. It's just not cut right.

joff · 12-27-2010, 06:29 PM

I stuffed a wad of steel wool down the EGR passages and JBwelded them shut. I also did the other side too.

I ported my extension manifold with a hacksaw and dremel. I removed the center support where the butterflies used to be then knife-edged and smoothed the exposed primary/secondary walls.

Now theres a better chance of taking advantage of the bigger throttle body:

joff · 01-01-2011, 08:14 PM

I used the OEM intake gasket to port match the LIM to UIM, and the gizzmo phenolic gasket to port match the LIM. It wasn't a lot of material but it sure did take awhile with the dremel.

Now that its done, I'm not sure if this was a good idea or not, as a local rotary expert told me that while it will help top end power by a few hp, it may create excessive intake reversion and low speed cruise backfiring/sputtering. Anybody else have any experience with this?

I'm hoping the effect is minimal on my mostly stock ports as I anticipate a bit of a driveability loss already by replacing the stock throttle body and loosing the way it opened up the primary butterfly first.

Xcessive LIM top (to stock UIM):

Xcessive LIM bottom:

stock UIM (to LIM):

Easy_E1 · 01-02-2011, 02:47 PM

Looks like you've been busy. Can't wait to see it on the road Jesse.

hades · 01-02-2011, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joff

Also, I designed in CAD and mocked up my airbox for the vmount. I think it will end up working pretty well. I tried to make it match the end tanks of the intercooler both for aesthetics and because I want it to be a tight fit & seal. I'll be sending this design to an online machineshop to be cut and formed out of .062" aluminum

Can you give more info on the on-line fab company you used? I model parts in Pro/E all day long. The hard part is finding a fab shop that won't rape you to make the part.

Thanks,

hades · 01-02-2011, 09:46 PM

CrispyRX7 port matched all of his manifolds with good results. I believe he made 422 @ 15 psi on a 35R T3.

http://www.reganrotaryracing.com/fdenginebuild.htm

http://www.reganrotaryracing.com/fde...doverview4.htm

***TitaniumTT*** · 01-02-2011, 11:00 PM

I think he's referring to Paul Yaw and his 12A port matched mani's that lost CFM.... It's odd I agree but makes me wonder none the less..... I've got a set of bone stock RE mani's that I should probably flow test.

joff · 01-06-2011, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hades

Can you give more info on the on-line fab company you used? I model parts in Pro/E all day long. The hard part is finding a fab shop that won't rape you to make the part.

Thanks,

I use emachineshop.com. You have to use their free CAD tool which isn't nearly as sophisticated as Pro/E or Solidworks, but you order straight from the software and it quotes your design in realtime which is convenient.

Its not bad $$ if you can stick to simple sheet aluminum cuts and bends. Trying to do anything that needs to be 3d machined it seems overly expensive for one-offs with emachineshop though they can do it.

Another site that can do simple metal cutting is ponoko.com. They can't bend but you can hand bend if you use the laser cut to remove slits from the bend lines. Ponoko can also do 3d printing in stainless steel or ABS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hades

CrispyRX7 port matched all of his manifolds with good results. I believe he made 422 @ 15 psi on a 35R T3.

FWIW, I actually PM'ed him to ask him if he had any obnoxious cruise/low load driveability issues and he said he had none whatsoever. I guess I'll see.

Cleaning all the metal shavings and sandblasting material out of that UIM was a real pain. The small amount of carbon buildup from the PCV/purge solenoid acted somewhat as an adhesive for all the sand/metal shavings and made them resistant to being blown out. I was pulling shop towels through the passages with wires for quite awhile before wising up and blasting the entire insides with brake cleaner to get rid of the gunk.

***TitaniumTT*** · 01-06-2011, 09:40 AM

Another way to do it would be to soak a towel in acetone and pull it through with a line. Has always worked well for me.

I've thought about extrude honing the manifolds, but can't really justify the near $700

joff · 01-06-2011, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

Another way to do it would be to soak a towel in acetone and pull it through with a line. Has always worked well for me.

Yep, I was doing exactly that with the shop towels. The acetone just was not cutting it as a solvent. I must have pulled about 5 towels through that way and each time the rags were coming out dirty from the PCV gunk. Whatever is in that brake cleaner is some strong stuff.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

I've thought about extrude honing the manifolds, but can't really justify the near $700

I wondered how expensive that would be. I would think there would be a lot to gain by simply polishing the inside passageways to get rid of the casting texture, but I didn't see an easy way get a sander in there.

One thing about that UIM is that even after porting it, pulling stuffed towels through it it definitely seems the biggest constriction is right at the UIM exit as thats when I had to use the most pulling force. I'll bet that since using the Xcessive LIM, this spot is the 2nd most constrictive point after the engine ports themselves.

chickenwafer · 01-10-2011, 08:11 PM

Looking good Jesse! Your attention to detail is awesome!

01-02-2011, 02:47 PM	#113
Easy_E1 4 Engines/3 Manifolds Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Phoenix, AZ iTrader: (0) Posts: 26 Rep Power: 0	Looks like you've been busy. Can't wait to see it on the road Jesse. __________________ The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten. BlackHaloRacing.com

01-02-2011, 09:46 PM	#115
hades Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Freedom Land iTrader: (0) Posts: 316 Rep Power: 17	CrispyRX7 port matched all of his manifolds with good results. I believe he made 422 @ 15 psi on a 35R T3. http://www.reganrotaryracing.com/fdenginebuild.htm http://www.reganrotaryracing.com/fde...doverview4.htm __________________ This is going to tear

01-02-2011, 11:00 PM	#116
*TitaniumTT* Test Whore - Admin Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Right Behind you son iTrader: (4) Posts: 4,581 Rep Power: 10	I think he's referring to Paul Yaw and his 12A port matched mani's that lost CFM.... It's odd I agree but makes me wonder none the less..... I've got a set of bone stock RE mani's that I should probably flow test. __________________ -The Angry Stig- DGRR 2009, 2011, 2012 & 2013 - Best FC DEALS GAP!! WOOHOOOO!!!!! 2015 Audi S4 - Samantha - Zero Brap S4 2004 RX8 - Jocelyn - 196rwhp, 19mpg fuel to noise converter 2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Wifey mobile - Now with 2.5" OME lift and 30" BFG AT KO's! So it begins 1998 Jeep Cherokee - 5 spd, 4" lift, 33" BFG's - Rotary Tow Vehicle 1988 'Vert - In progress 1988 FC Coupe - Gretchen -The attention whore BEAST! I'm a sick individual, what's wrong with you? I'm pure Evil I'm still insane, in the best possible way. I think Brian's idea of romance is using lube. Your rage caused the meteor strike in Russia. The Antichrist would be proud of his minion. You win with your thread. Most everything It's a truck with a steel gate on the back. Just a statement of fact Motec M820, AIM dash, ported 13B-RE Cosmo, 6-spd trans, 4.3 Torsen, custom twin wg fully divided mani, Custom 4" split into 2x 3" exhaust, Custom HMIC, Custom custom custom custom I like to welder stuff.... No Bolt-ons allowed. Dyno'ed @ Speed1 Tuned by me - 405rwhp on WG.... WM50 cuming soon. *-Angry Motherfcker Mode ENGAGED-**

01-06-2011, 09:40 AM	#118
*TitaniumTT* Test Whore - Admin Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Right Behind you son iTrader: (4) Posts: 4,581 Rep Power: 10	Another way to do it would be to soak a towel in acetone and pull it through with a line. Has always worked well for me. I've thought about extrude honing the manifolds, but can't really justify the near $700 __________________ -The Angry Stig- DGRR 2009, 2011, 2012 & 2013 - Best FC DEALS GAP!! WOOHOOOO!!!!! 2015 Audi S4 - Samantha - Zero Brap S4 2004 RX8 - Jocelyn - 196rwhp, 19mpg fuel to noise converter 2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Wifey mobile - Now with 2.5" OME lift and 30" BFG AT KO's! So it begins 1998 Jeep Cherokee - 5 spd, 4" lift, 33" BFG's - Rotary Tow Vehicle 1988 'Vert - In progress 1988 FC Coupe - Gretchen -The attention whore BEAST! I'm a sick individual, what's wrong with you? I'm pure Evil I'm still insane, in the best possible way. I think Brian's idea of romance is using lube. Your rage caused the meteor strike in Russia. The Antichrist would be proud of his minion. You win with your thread. Most everything It's a truck with a steel gate on the back. Just a statement of fact Motec M820, AIM dash, ported 13B-RE Cosmo, 6-spd trans, 4.3 Torsen, custom twin wg fully divided mani, Custom 4" split into 2x 3" exhaust, Custom HMIC, Custom custom custom custom I like to welder stuff.... No Bolt-ons allowed. Dyno'ed @ Speed1 Tuned by me - 405rwhp on WG.... WM50 cuming soon. *-Angry Motherfcker Mode ENGAGED-**

12-23-2010, 09:24 AM	#106
RCCAZ 1 Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Phoenix, AZ iTrader: (0) Posts: 288 Rep Power: 17	Looking awesome Jesse. Nice work. Where did you get that turbo blanket? Really fits nicely!! Keep it coming and let me know if you need help. I'm off now until the new year!

12-23-2010, 11:41 AM	#107
joff Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Mesa, Arizona iTrader: (0) Posts: 114 Rep Power: 16	Thanks for the heads up guys -- a while ago I did a little research on this and did see a thread somewhere where some of the white plastic phenolic gaskets had warped. The gasket I have is from gizzmo and is definitely from a different material. I'd guess its something like the FR44 material we use for manufacturing circuit boards. Is this the EGR port you were talking about? It seems to cover it -- maybe by not much margin. I'll probably see about plugging that EGR hole with some aluminum or JBweld. The turbo blanket I think I got from ebay. Its pretty thin actually, but that works for me because I'm a little worried about too much heat in the turbo. I painted it with the same 1500degF silicone sealant paint I painted the header wrap with. Thanks Tim, I'd take you up on some help this week if it weren't for the fact we'll be in Tucson visiting family.

12-23-2010, 10:43 PM	#108
speedjunkie RCC Loves Me Not You Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Colorado Springs, CO iTrader: (1) Posts: 2,089 Rep Power: 19	Yep, that is the exact same gasket I have with the exact same specs, not completely covering the exact same EGR port LOL. I guess if you cover it with JB Weld or something that would work too. Good luck with all that. Just wanted to give you a heads up so you didn't get it together and then try to figure out where the leak was coming from LOL. Mine looked the same btw. It looked like it was covering, but air still came out of there.

12-24-2010, 01:26 AM	#110
speedjunkie RCC Loves Me Not You Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Colorado Springs, CO iTrader: (1) Posts: 2,089 Rep Power: 19	^I don't think these are the ones that warp, I honestly think these might have a good chance of standing up to the heat. That little bit of the EGR port is enough to leak enough air to make it sound like a motorcycle. So it's already bad just the way it is, it doesn't take warping to make it sound like crap haha. And the ones the other guys on 7club had were made by a different company I believe. So far no one that has had a Gizzmo one (that I know of) has had it warp. It's just not cut right.

12-27-2010, 06:29 PM	#111
joff Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Mesa, Arizona iTrader: (0) Posts: 114 Rep Power: 16	I stuffed a wad of steel wool down the EGR passages and JBwelded them shut. I also did the other side too. I ported my extension manifold with a hacksaw and dremel. I removed the center support where the butterflies used to be then knife-edged and smoothed the exposed primary/secondary walls. Now theres a better chance of taking advantage of the bigger throttle body:

01-01-2011, 08:14 PM	#112
joff Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Mesa, Arizona iTrader: (0) Posts: 114 Rep Power: 16	I used the OEM intake gasket to port match the LIM to UIM, and the gizzmo phenolic gasket to port match the LIM. It wasn't a lot of material but it sure did take awhile with the dremel. Now that its done, I'm not sure if this was a good idea or not, as a local rotary expert told me that while it will help top end power by a few hp, it may create excessive intake reversion and low speed cruise backfiring/sputtering. Anybody else have any experience with this? I'm hoping the effect is minimal on my mostly stock ports as I anticipate a bit of a driveability loss already by replacing the stock throttle body and loosing the way it opened up the primary butterfly first. Xcessive LIM top (to stock UIM): Xcessive LIM bottom: stock UIM (to LIM):

01-10-2011, 08:11 PM	#120
chickenwafer Boost Whore Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Northern Colorado iTrader: (0) Posts: 33 Rep Power: 0	Looking good Jesse! Your attention to detail is awesome!