Traction control, wheel speed sensors... who wants 'em?

[vex]

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT

Blows.... Motec 1 Haltech ZERO!! AHAHAHAHAHAHAA

Race Logic? Not a fan of piggy backs but some poeple use and love that system

I think Haltech could be able to get traction control off wheel speed input without much issue (read that as nothing more than a software upgrade). They already have the inputs for it. All that would need to be done would be a spring-mass-damper (PID) to balance both the engine generated wheel speed and the vehicle actual speed by either ignition or fuel correction.

[TitaniumTT]

Yup yup.... should be pretty easy actually... but I'm not a software guyD... and I'm surprised that they don't have it. Now, DBW would be the shit..... can someone say FD build

[vex]

Dbw?

[Max777]

I'm gonna ask the big "what" to these.

I saw this and thought about the OEM wheel speed sensors/ trigger wheels. Why not just use those? Seeing they are already designed for the car, bolt right up and dont require modification?

I assume that the factory parts would be a little challenging to find, but didn't every FC with ABS come with wheel speed sensors?

[RICE RACING]

We have a good topic on this over on the Supra forums

Race Logic TC for the win http://www.supraforums.com/forum/sho...-street-action

[TitaniumTT]

Booooooo, must register to view.... wanna share some highlights?

Anything the RL can do, the Motec can do as well..... just a little more complicated, and I like to be able to cut both fuel and spark.

[vex]

Unfortunately you need to register for that forum Rice.

[TitaniumTT]

Originally Posted by Max777

I'm gonna ask the big "what" to these.

I saw this and thought about the OEM wheel speed sensors/ trigger wheels. Why not just use those? Seeing they are already designed for the car, bolt right up and dont require modification?

I assume that the factory parts would be a little challenging to find, but didn't every FC with ABS come with wheel speed sensors?

1) Not many FC's came with ABS
2) Going from memory the trigger wheels were $90 each (as opposed to $10)
3) Going from memory the sensors were $190 each (As opposed to $80 wired)
4) The factory sensors are a mag pickup, so to use with an ECU, you most likely need a converter - $118x2
5) IIRC 96 teeth per trigger wheel the the signal gets a little funky around 85 mph
6) Factory parts are nearly impossible to find used. I found the wheels just fine, sensors proved difficult as they like to seize into the hubs making removal difficult.
7) Custom is my way of life
8) TitaniumTT has spoken

Originally Posted by vex

Dbw?

Drive
By
Wire

[Max777]

Thanks for the 411. Aside from availability concerns, the signal clarity issue is something i was looking for as a concern. I think that I would be in on this as well even if it takes a while for me to make use of the parts.

[TitaniumTT]

OK... so here's the list

if you want to be removed post up. I'm expecting to order these in the next couple of days so I want to get this firmed up. Keep notice that prices will vary depending on the plating... but for this price if you're bitchin', you need a new Hobby

TitaniumTT - 2 full sets
Glennypoo - one of each
Tweiss - One set
Max777 - One set
Limbar - one set???

[Ender]

I don't think my Rtek could take advantage of these, but I want to understand how they work. Is the basic idea that if the sensors detect a difference in the speed between either rear wheel and the fronts on acceleration then the ECU will tell the boost controller to bring the boost down to reduce spin?

[RETed]

I'd like to make a suggestion on the design of the trigger wheel...

The current design shown in the pics makes the trigger wheel kinda delicate?
The "fins" could get bent due to debris being kicked up into the wheel?

I would run an "outer ring" just to "protect" the fins from getting bent.
Bent is bad, right?

This might increase the price of production due to the fact that (laser) cutters don't like to start and stop during each piece.


-Ted

[TitaniumTT]

Yes, bent is bad...

I like the suggestion, but not sure if it's needed. The material is .3125" thick in the front, .25" in the rear, and the trigger surface is .125" thick. The things are pretty stout. The other advantage is they tuck inside the rotor hat so they're protected. Can't see it in the pics I posted becuase there's no rotor but they're way tucked in there. I've got the front wheels off, I'll try to get a pick today as I'm actually going to have a little time to work on my car... imagine that!

The other problem is going to be fitment. The depth of the tooth needs to be .7" deep as that's the diameter of the sensor. Nothing solid can be in front of the sensor otherwise it will never sense off the base or the outer ring. It would add another 1/4" to the diameter and I'm not sure if it would fit or not....

[TitaniumTT]

Originally Posted by Ender

I don't think my Rtek could take advantage of these, but I want to understand how they work. Is the basic idea that if the sensors detect a difference in the speed between either rear wheel and the fronts on acceleration then the ECU will tell the boost controller to bring the boost down to reduce spin?

Nope, you're Rtek wouldn't be able to use these. You would need the Race Logic box to take advantage of these.

The RL box doesn't adjust the boost, nor does my ECU. I've got my boost control as boost vs gear and boost vs tps and boost vs trim switch and boost vs how aroused I am so adding the TC is really like adding a back-up. I can run a more aggressive boost curve and let the TC do it's thing when the ass step's out in the higher RPM's.

You're right though, the basic idea is to sense the difference in speed between the rolling wheels and the driven wheels, taking into account a difference in wheel speed in the rear when turning, and soft cutting the ignition. Brian is excited to see these things work

[TitaniumTT]

Good News/Bad News ladies

The rear trigger wheel will fit over the rear wheel bearing thus saving them. The bad news is they won't fit inside the stock rear rotor. They'll fit inside mine though

Making the rears can be done with a drill press and a jigsaw and a 1/4" AL plate and some 10-24 bolts and nuts.

The fronts will still fit just fine.

Soooooo who wants in still? I'm assuming no one