s4 na to s5 or s5 na swap?

Fidelity101 · 11-19-2008, 02:31 PM

so my old s4 motor is lone gone now and I just picked up an s5 motor from an 89 with 98k on it, came with harness and manifolds.

Initially I was just expecting to get the short block and swap manifolds, but its got the harness to it and everything.

I plan on running premix regardless, but the main question is what would suit me better? using my s4 electronic control system on my s5 motor with s4 manifolds or using the s5 setup entirely (I have an RB header, so no use of the stock exh manifold thank god)

and here is the kicker, earlier in the fall someone decided to smash my passenger side window out and totally smash my spedo/odometer so I would likely get a new cluster anyways and thats have the battle, all I would need is an ECU, I want to get rid of the power windows anyways and go to manual.

I'd assume I would also need the s5 idiot cluster too.

am I forgetting anything?

also, the hybrid intake manifold swap I know of people using the s5 UIM intake on the s4 LIM using the VDI for more power, but is this for just s4 blocks? should I go with a hybrid intake manifold or just use the S5 one?

Whizbang · 11-19-2008, 02:55 PM

my vert has the S5 manifold on an S4 lower and it sure as hell makes less power....

drewski86 · 11-19-2008, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Low Impedance

my vert has the S5 manifold on an S4 lower and it sure as hell makes less power....

Is your VDI functioning? Did you tune for the new manifold? If you're making less power there is something wrong.

WE3RX7 · 11-19-2008, 04:25 PM

S5 and S4 dash harnesses are totally different, you cant just swap in an S5 cluster into an S4 car. You need S5 everything basically. If you have access to S5 cluster, dash harness, logicon, ecu, efi harness, engine and power harness I'd swap it all, otherwise - just use what you've got and keep it s4.

you can use the s5 block w/ s4 manifolds and accessories and efi w/out trouble. The s5 is slightly higher compression which will be a bonus by itself.

Flooder · 11-19-2008, 05:47 PM

Don't quote me on this, but im pretty sure the ports dont line up exactly right when putting s4 manifolds on an S5 and vice versa. And I know the timing is different on each motor. Keep the motor S5 and use the S5 ecu. I wouldn't worry about the gauge cluster until you get the car running. You can re-pin the gauge cluster to work.

As far as what else you will need I think the pressure sensor and TPS if the motor didnt come with all the electronics and accessories on it already.

Fidelity101 · 11-19-2008, 07:29 PM

the efi/ecu harness came with every sensor but the air flow sensor, ecu, TPS. I have an s4 one but I know I will need an s5 one.

I know I can't just swap the cluster in, worst case scenario I have to re pin it.

My gauge cluster is fucked, I'll post a picture of it later. besides that the accessory gauges don't work on it except fuel and volts.

basically I need a new cluster regardless, might as well get an s5 one, it would be easier.

I'm short the logicon and the dash harness, I don't have a stereo or anything and I rarely use my HVAC controls, mostly will just keep it on defrost.

I could probably run 2 ecu's and have the S4 one control the dash/hvac controls.

and this is what I'm prepping for my car right now, I got to down to keg + flywheel

got all that for 500.

I have a RB AL flywheel but right now I need an s5 counterweight, I cant grind the s4 one down to the s5 weight spec unfortunately.

I got all winter to do everything so that makes it better, however I would like to get it runing for the winter so I can take it through the snow but there is always next winter.

but will I need an s5 starter too? I hope not

I'm going to run premix so I will just make a block off plate for the front cover and use the s5 front cover, also going to get rid of the extra main pulley ribs that I don't use, ie PS and AC.

11-20-2008, 05:59 AM

go with S5 block and S4 intake manifold so u dont have to swap out the ecu and engine harness etc..

this is a DIRECT drop in then and easy to deal with..

alos use the S4 front cover you have.. again makes things much easier.

Max777 · 11-20-2008, 09:54 AM

http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/2ndgen/techmenu.html

everything you need to know about it right there!

Flooder · 11-20-2008, 01:55 PM

I have all the S5 na sensors that you'll need, as well as the gauge cluster if your interested. I wouldn't recommend running the s5 motor with s4 manifolds.

11-20-2008, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flooder

I have all the S5 na sensors that you'll need, as well as the gauge cluster if your interested. I wouldn't recommend running the s5 motor with s4 manifolds.

howcome.. thats totally acceptable..

87turbo_turtle · 11-20-2008, 02:21 PM

yes you will need a new starter

WE3RX7 · 11-20-2008, 02:21 PM

I'm w/ spooledupracing.....

Go S5 block, S4 front cover and manifolds, including the TB. You can even run the mechanical OMP and still run a little extra premix for safety. Its a no brainer and will take the least amount of time/effort.

Once you get it in and running, if you feel like it, swap over to the S5 UIM.

fire85gslse · 11-29-2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WE3RX7

I'm w/ spooledupracing.....
Go S5 block, S4 front cover and manifolds, including the TB. You can even run the mechanical OMP and still run a little extra premix for safety. Its a no brainer and will take the least amount of time/effort.
Once you get it in and running, if you feel like it, swap over to the S5 UIM.

What ^^^ said!

11-20-2008, 02:35 PM

yes S5 and S4 starters are different.

Whizbang · 11-20-2008, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpooledupRacing

yes S5 and S4 starters are different.

what exactly are the differences.

11-19-2008, 02:31 PM	#1
Fidelity101 Reliable Source Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Michigan/Illinois iTrader: (1) Posts: 336 Rep Power: 17	s4 na to s5 or s5 na swap? so my old s4 motor is lone gone now and I just picked up an s5 motor from an 89 with 98k on it, came with harness and manifolds. Initially I was just expecting to get the short block and swap manifolds, but its got the harness to it and everything. I plan on running premix regardless, but the main question is what would suit me better? using my s4 electronic control system on my s5 motor with s4 manifolds or using the s5 setup entirely (I have an RB header, so no use of the stock exh manifold thank god) and here is the kicker, earlier in the fall someone decided to smash my passenger side window out and totally smash my spedo/odometer so I would likely get a new cluster anyways and thats have the battle, all I would need is an ECU, I want to get rid of the power windows anyways and go to manual. I'd assume I would also need the s5 idiot cluster too. am I forgetting anything? also, the hybrid intake manifold swap I know of people using the s5 UIM intake on the s4 LIM using the VDI for more power, but is this for just s4 blocks? should I go with a hybrid intake manifold or just use the S5 one? __________________ My Rx-7 Vids

11-19-2008, 02:55 PM	#2
Whizbang Respecognize! Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Δx = ħ/2Δp iTrader: (5) Posts: 3,190 Rep Power: 20	my vert has the S5 manifold on an S4 lower and it sure as hell makes less power.... __________________ For current updates and event coverage check out Follow on Twitter! @WhizbangRally Whizbang Rally's Webpage \| Facebook

11-19-2008, 05:47 PM	#5
Flooder Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Tucson, Arizona iTrader: (0) Posts: 321 Rep Power: 17	Don't quote me on this, but im pretty sure the ports dont line up exactly right when putting s4 manifolds on an S5 and vice versa. And I know the timing is different on each motor. Keep the motor S5 and use the S5 ecu. I wouldn't worry about the gauge cluster until you get the car running. You can re-pin the gauge cluster to work. As far as what else you will need I think the pressure sensor and TPS if the motor didnt come with all the electronics and accessories on it already. __________________ AZRX7.COM Red 1991 A-package(SOLD) Red 1990 GXL(SOLD) White 1989 GTUs(DEAD) Red 1988 Turbo II(DD) Black 1988 Turbo II(SOLD) Rebuilt and street ported motor, Garrett T04E Turbo, 3" Turbo Inlet Duct/AEM Dry Flow Filter, Your Mom's MBC, Blitz FMIC, 890cc and 1000cc injectors, Tomei FPR, Walbro, Rtek 2.1 ECU, Taurus E-Fan, Turbonetics BOV, 3" Motoria/Corksport Turbo Back Exhaust, Emissions Removed, Greddy Boost Gauge, Megan Racing Water Temp Gauge, 5one5 Triple Gauge Pod, AEM Uego, GP Sports Body Kit, Fiber Images CF Hood, S5 Seats, S5 Tails, S5 Alt, Dual Alt Pulley, D2 Coilovers, NRG Quick Release, Shook Motorsports Radiator, HID's, AN/Steel Braided Oil Cooler Lines, SUPER JDM TYTE DRIFT BUTTON www.DensetsuMotorsports.com www.AZRX7.Com www.FloodersAdventure.com

11-19-2008, 07:29 PM	#6
Fidelity101 Reliable Source Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Michigan/Illinois iTrader: (1) Posts: 336 Rep Power: 17	the efi/ecu harness came with every sensor but the air flow sensor, ecu, TPS. I have an s4 one but I know I will need an s5 one. I know I can't just swap the cluster in, worst case scenario I have to re pin it. My gauge cluster is fucked, I'll post a picture of it later. besides that the accessory gauges don't work on it except fuel and volts. basically I need a new cluster regardless, might as well get an s5 one, it would be easier. I'm short the logicon and the dash harness, I don't have a stereo or anything and I rarely use my HVAC controls, mostly will just keep it on defrost. I could probably run 2 ecu's and have the S4 one control the dash/hvac controls. and this is what I'm prepping for my car right now, I got to down to keg + flywheel got all that for 500. I have a RB AL flywheel but right now I need an s5 counterweight, I cant grind the s4 one down to the s5 weight spec unfortunately. I got all winter to do everything so that makes it better, however I would like to get it runing for the winter so I can take it through the snow but there is always next winter. but will I need an s5 starter too? I hope not I'm going to run premix so I will just make a block off plate for the front cover and use the s5 front cover, also going to get rid of the extra main pulley ribs that I don't use, ie PS and AC. __________________ My Rx-7 Vids Last edited by Fidelity101; 11-19-2008 at 07:34 PM..

11-20-2008, 09:54 AM	#8
Max777 Pirate Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Central IL iTrader: (5) Posts: 1,323 Rep Power: 18	http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/2ndgen/techmenu.html everything you need to know about it right there! __________________ Rotaries:They are NOT that complicated!

11-19-2008, 04:25 PM	#4
WE3RX7 RCC Addict Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: VA iTrader: (1) Posts: 1,812 Rep Power: 18	S5 and S4 dash harnesses are totally different, you cant just swap in an S5 cluster into an S4 car. You need S5 everything basically. If you have access to S5 cluster, dash harness, logicon, ecu, efi harness, engine and power harness I'd swap it all, otherwise - just use what you've got and keep it s4. you can use the s5 block w/ s4 manifolds and accessories and efi w/out trouble. The s5 is slightly higher compression which will be a bonus by itself.

11-20-2008, 05:59 AM	#7
SpooledupRacing Guest Posts: n/a	go with S5 block and S4 intake manifold so u dont have to swap out the ecu and engine harness etc.. this is a DIRECT drop in then and easy to deal with.. alos use the S4 front cover you have.. again makes things much easier.

11-20-2008, 01:55 PM	#9
Flooder Rotary Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Tucson, Arizona iTrader: (0) Posts: 321 Rep Power: 17	I have all the S5 na sensors that you'll need, as well as the gauge cluster if your interested. I wouldn't recommend running the s5 motor with s4 manifolds. __________________ AZRX7.COM Red 1991 A-package(SOLD) Red 1990 GXL(SOLD) White 1989 GTUs(DEAD) Red 1988 Turbo II(DD) Black 1988 Turbo II(SOLD) Rebuilt and street ported motor, Garrett T04E Turbo, 3" Turbo Inlet Duct/AEM Dry Flow Filter, Your Mom's MBC, Blitz FMIC, 890cc and 1000cc injectors, Tomei FPR, Walbro, Rtek 2.1 ECU, Taurus E-Fan, Turbonetics BOV, 3" Motoria/Corksport Turbo Back Exhaust, Emissions Removed, Greddy Boost Gauge, Megan Racing Water Temp Gauge, 5one5 Triple Gauge Pod, AEM Uego, GP Sports Body Kit, Fiber Images CF Hood, S5 Seats, S5 Tails, S5 Alt, Dual Alt Pulley, D2 Coilovers, NRG Quick Release, Shook Motorsports Radiator, HID's, AN/Steel Braided Oil Cooler Lines, SUPER JDM TYTE DRIFT BUTTON www.DensetsuMotorsports.com www.AZRX7.Com www.FloodersAdventure.com

11-20-2008, 02:21 PM	#11
87turbo_turtle Rotary Chic Join Date: May 2008 Location: New Holland, SC iTrader: (0) Posts: 232 Rep Power: 17	yes you will need a new starter __________________ Turtle Yes I am a girl and I will kick your butt. Prove yourself.

11-20-2008, 02:35 PM	#14
SpooledupRacing Guest Posts: n/a	yes S5 and S4 starters are different.

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