So I ended up measuring my endplay tonight. Came out to a perfect .002

I also put on my front cover & accessories, oil pan and started to fit my EGT probes. I had my machine shop at work drill and tap my HKS cast mani so all I need to do now is route the wiring and figure out a place for my gauges.

Engine install starts on Monday and should be on the road tues(most likely sooner.....wife HATES me right now since I sneek into the garage whenever she turns her back:))

I will post pics soon.

Sweet! Nice going Sean, glad to hear everything worked out.

What are you using for probes/gauges?

And don't worry to much about the wife, they get over it quick..... unless you make the mistake that I did and make a smartass remark like, "well hun, until they figure out a way to make tailpipes warm moist and inviting, I'll still need you for something." :rofl: Best thing to do is encourage a few.... ok ALOT of "girls nights out." Weekends away visiting the in-laws wroks well for 7 progress too. Stock up on the redull and rock 36 hour day :icon_tup:

[QUOTE=

"well hun, until they figure out a way to make tailpipes warm moist and inviting, I'll still need you for something." :rofl: QUOTE]

hahaha thats hilarious. it went together pretty nicely if i do say so myself. the first rotor we put in was a little bitch though. sean ill be there monday, i asked for it off so i could be there for some of it at least.

Looks awesome. Is that a miata battery in the current setup pic?

Well I dropped the motor in yesterday and routed the turbo/dp/exhaust system. Also routes my EGT leads and re-wrapped my HKS mani. I am surprised how much the DEI Ceramic rattle can held up. No flaking what so ever.

Really all I have left is the UIM, LIM and fuels set up. Add some fluids and start her up. However I can not find a damn place to mount these egt gauges! it is killing me. :)

Brian, you mentioned I should do a comp test before I let it run then one after an hour correct?

I am most likely going to start her on Sunday so I will try to get it on video. I am a little nervous for the comp test but if it is low due to my parinoia about the apex seal spring installation then I will just open her up and stack again(hope not).

No just a Optima red top

Mount 'em like I mounted my extra three gauges, do away with the idiot lights.

More just for curiousity. If there was anything that went wrong during the assembly - pinched side seal, apex seal, bad springs, missing a cornerseal, something horrendous like that, it'll show up in the first comp test and MAYBE you'll be able to catch it before it does real damamge but if a side seal slipped out of place, the damage was probably done with the keg was torqued. Just things to make you more paranoid. If you heard 3 clean even whooshes and the engine spun freely, you really have nothing to be worried about. It's more for curiosity. In my case, Dave and I are worried about me overoiling the engine with the OMP and a bit of premix in the gas. So my comp tests are just to make sure that the comp doesn't fall off from over oiling.

Like I said Sean, if you heard some even pulses and the motor spun pretty freely by hand, stop being paranoid, clean the sand out, get some douche and go to town ;)

All will be fine - you would know by now if you installed anything horribly wrong.

i was there helpin him put it all together and when he spun it sounded good. im excited for this.. oh boy

Hey all! Well I got everything tied up tonight. All fliuds are in and she is pretty much ready for start up. I WOULD HAVE started it tonight but unfortunately my daughter's room is right above the garage and I didn't want to smoke her out. :) I could have dropped the FC to the ground and wheeled it outside but I like to keep it on jack stands for the first start up for the ease of inspecting and accessing leaks if I need to lay on the creeper for.

I also calibrated my WB o2 with my datalogit to be within .01 of my actual xd-16 gauge. I did a trick that Chuck Westbrook has in his notes that includes a jar, syran wrap, propane tourch and a straw.

As for those fucking EGT gauges I am still undecided. I think for now they will live in the glove box until I can lay some new carbon fiber so I can re-arrange my center console layout.

I like the two gauge set up now becasue I can still see my clock from my seat:rofl:

I know I have finally just convinced myself it is fine. It is what it is.

Thanks again bro for being there for the whole thing. Having your set of eyes was good not to mention u spotting that apex seal spring in the coolant passage was a HUGE time saver. I know we heard it but I never saw it.

I bet the anticipation is killing you. :rofl:

:o11: You must elaborate

Basically what you do with the WB o2 calibration is: get a mason jar and put the o2 sensor in with the tip of your propane torch. Wrap the SOB in a ton of syran wrap and turn your IGN on to heat up your o2 sensor. Then once the sensor is hot, turn on the propane torch until the gauge reads 9.0 AFR or whatever. What I wanted to tune for was 11.0 AFR and I wanted my datalogit to read 100% correct with my gauge.

So when I turned the propane on my reading skyrocketed to 9.0 AFR. The straw is inserted and you blow a little air into the sealed jar until you reach 11.0(or what ever you want your WOT AFR to be). The you go into you tuning software and adjust your voltage to AFR correlation.

my factory innovative set up was supposed to be 0-5v:9-15.99AFR. I had to cahnge it to 0-5v: 9.2-15.99AFR to get my logs from my datalogit correct with my xd-16 gauge.

Anyhow, Start up happens tonight!!! Stay tuned!

freakn' macgyver

SO....? the anticipation is killin me.

Alright guys.

She started up with ease. Primed the oil system to 40psi and then gave her fuel. Took a couple turns and then she finally started. I needed to re-adjust my cold start/fuel ratio and all in all she idled around 1k with a 11.7 AFR.

I had a nice 1-2-3 pulse coming from the exhaust. MY VACCUUM was at -13 on my boost controller.

SOO..then it took forever to warm up to 80*C. Once it got there she keep climbing and climbing and no thermostat was opening by 86* C! I immediately shut the car off and hear my boil over resivoir going ape shit. A few seconds later after I know something is seriously wrong, I turn on my ignition again to see what my water-thermo sensor log is reading and it says 115*C!!

I scream FUCKKKKK. I say, "it's toast, its fucking toast!" Well one one my buddies pops the resivoir cap and a huge burp of air comes out. I check my water temp gauge again(about 45 seconds later) and it is down to 96*C within that 1 minute time frame.

So I THOUGHT the system was burped 100% but obviously not. By now I am thinking the motor is fucked. I mean the fucking gauge read 115*C !! I am sick to my stomach by now.

So my buddies are like "well you have a floor fan blowing on it, your oil temps were only 165*F and you were at idle only (no revs) and really the temp was most likely steam temp from the enourmous air bubble since the temp dropped dramatically from when it "burped", so it will be fine, yeah yeah fine..
..it will be fine..?.."

I on the other hand am thinking of Brians story and am convinced that I have either fucked the rotor housings or definately have a stuck side seal now and again am just PISSED..devasted actually.

So I started her up again after adding about a qauter jug of coolant. I am expecting to see a lower vacuum and hear a sparatic pulse from my exhaust........

She starts up fine.....I have 3 perfectly audible pulses- brap-.brap-.brap and my vacuum was at -14. I got more vacuum!?!

So I am sitting there just kinda confused and still feeling unsettled. I let it idle for an hour and no changes in pulses or vacuum. Steady -14 the whole way. I do have a very small oil leak coming from my front pulley bolts that is flinging VERY VERY small droplets of oil everywhere. I will deal with that later.


I don't know what to think guys. She shows no sign of overheat conditions and I have no white smoke, no un-even pulses and a higher vacuum.


I guess all I can do is drive her tomorrow for a 100 miles and check my compression.

Is my buddies thinking right and can the motor take a small burst of heat like that. There really was no stress on the motor oil temp wise or even heat saturation for that matter. i don't know..

I am still very sick to my stomcah from the whole situation partly because I didn't bleed it all the way and that was a FUCKING high temp at that water thermo sensor.

Anyone have any other conditions I should look for that are related to overheating?

She runs great but MAN what a cluster. :o10:

Localized hot spot...no big deal.
If the motor ate the water seals, you would've seen water out your tailpipe and temps start to shoot up again.

I've done it before in my modified coolant flush - very controversial.

Just because you see the water temps peg doesn't mean the motor is automatically goners.


-Ted

Well it has been a little over an hour and a half since I shut her down and after doing a little more research on overheat conditons I went back down and looked for culprits of fucked water seals. I had NO bubbles in my radiator and when I started her up again WITH my garage door close(to see smoke better) I had absolutely no white smoke on start up.

The motors water temp at start up was 56* C, so if I had fucked a water seal that would have bleed into the combustion chamber by now.....right? :)

I am a little comforted now and I also read a couple lucky stories on the RX&club with guys having the exact same secnario and one dude actually hit 250* F and had no issues.
LETS JUST HOPE.

Thanks TED, I am sweating over this fuck up but think it is OK.

My water temps stayed at a cool 81*C the whole idle time after the incident btw.

Well just fixed the front pulley e-shaft bolt oil leak. Had a buddy stop by(project 86) because he helped build it and he wanted to hear it pur and I ended up putting him to work.:rofl: I had him hold the clutch in while I removed the front pulley bolt to apply some rtv to the o-ring and copper washer face.

Started her up again about 1/2 hour later and ZERO white smoke and no oil spitting all over my engine bay. I am high off of gas fumes.

Need sleep......I must have spent an hour at least tonight dousching out the sand from my vag after the scare. :)

Sounds like a pretty scary situation. I'm glad it all worked out though :icon_tup:.

Close call heh. When I first got my rebuild running, temps were around 95-98C for the first few days of driving, until I got all the bubbles out. Now it's solid at 82C :)

Yep, That is the water temp I had the last three hours of driving her. Put on a whopping 32 miles in city. Had to stop for lunch too though.

As for my intial tune from my last motor it is pretty damn close. I was a little lean on cruise but all-in-all it was the same AFR's driving aroound town I had with the last motor. I would love to get my damn idle at least above 12 insead of this 11.5 BS. Damn PFC.

My vacuum also got better just after today, now I am seeing -15 at idle.
Gonna wash her tonight and will have some video and pics up of her running.

She feels great too btw in regards to throttle response and just power to 3000 rpm(didn't go any higher).

Gave her a little wash this evening too with help from my little helper

great day all in all!

Hey Sean, yeah man, Ted's right, I wouldn't sweat it at all. The EXACT same thing happened to me with engine #3. Took forever to get to 180* then SKYROCKETED to 210 with me hosing the piss out of the rad but the bubble was most likely caught in the WP which means no circulation. Oil temps were like 150's which is a big cooling factor in our motor's. I wouldn't sweat it at all. Just be easy with the girl ;)

As for the more vac, well, she broke in a little bit. I need to find the conversion sheet for MAP -> "hg, it's fricken killing me. I'm seeing high 40-low 50's vac. My Autometer boost gauge I know is a little off from the Motec so I just go off the Motec.... anyone know the conversions?

Still Love that color & damn, you put everyone to work eh?

haha sean i dont think you could have found a better helper! she s gonna be able to tune the damn thing!

-15" vac is just about right, what's your idle? Mine is humming at around 16 and sometimes 17" at 800RPM since I finished the break-in

I want to see 19". What's that in kpa damnit?

My idle is @ 998 RPM.

I am intrigued as well in regards to a conversion table.

www.onlineconversion.com has all the conversions you can think of

19" Hg = 64.341 kpa

15" Hg = 50.795 kpa

Thanks Max.

I took it out for about two hours last night and put another 52 miles on her. Here in Great Falls 52 miles in city is a shit load of drving and punching your kidneys.

I CANT stand people who feel the need to fuck with me when I am driving. I no shit had about 6 cars/trucks toy with me. All I would do is smile and if they asked why no go I would just say "break in". This old ass Nova kept messing with me until I finally told him to piss off and come see me in a month. He laughed and was actually cordial after the fact. He just put a 383 stoker in it and just got done breaking in the motor.
I am seriously about to go cray with my idle AFR. I dont want to do negative inj lag to get my idle leaner BUT if I have to I will. Better now before any major tuning happens.
Is negative lag bad for your injectors? I know it shouldn't effect duty cycle but can't remember what the down side is.

I do have to say I love how my motor sounds at idle. Between the intake and exhaust ports it has a awesome almost lobe sound, kinda like an aggressive cam on a piston motor. Good stuff.

Only other "issue" right now is my damn NAPA high dollar belts are noisy, really noisy. Even with belt dressing, adjusting tension and doing the crayon trick they still make noise. I might have to go O'rielly cheapies

Hey Johnson, I've used that site alot but it doesn't make any sense whatsoever. The less kpa you have, the more vac you pull. 100 kpa = 1 bar = 0 vac, 0 kpa should = perfect vac or about 30", so what are we missing here?

Crayon trick?

Yeah, buddy told me to line the outside of the belts with crayon. Actually last night the belts were quite by the end of the drive. Maybe the belts just required a little break in themselves.

More miles added last night. My EGT temps are a great tool for tuning cruise. My damn rear rotor seems to burn a little hotter even with 2% more fuel to the rear injectors. I almost wonder if that damn HKS cast mani is just the problem. The runners are not equal so maybe that plays a role in temperture recording(however the probes are equal distance from mani inlet AND equal depth).

[QUOTE=TitaniumTT;94667]Hey Johnson, I've used that site alot but it doesn't make any sense whatsoever. The less kpa you have, the more vac you pull. 100 kpa = 1 bar = 0 vac, 0 kpa should = perfect vac or about 30", so what are we missing here?
[QUOTE]

Vacuum is rated at inches of mercury, so the higher the vacuum, the higher the kpa value.
100 kpa = 1 bar = almost 30" of mercury in vacuum
0 kpa = 0" of mercury = no vacuum

This is very tricky to explain. I've probably typed and deleted a whole bunch of sentences just because they sound confusing.

"The less kpa you have, the more vac you pull." This is true, only if 0 is perfect vacuum, and any value above that is pressure. What's missing is the idea of reference zeros. Our boost gauges put the reference at atmospheric pressure (1bar, 100kpa, 14.5psi). Below that point is vacuum, usually measured in inches of mercury, for standard units. 30" Hg = 0psi absolute = 0kpa absolute = -14.5psi = -100kpa = -1 bar.

You might be wondering, "why is 30" Hg positive then?" I believe the reason for that is units for above atmospheric pressures are different. If boost read in " Hg, vacuum would then read in - " Hg. Also the generally accepted standard unit for vacuum is inches of Mercury, which is why negative signs are neglected.

My boost controller reads in psi, so in vacuum, I'm somewhere around -7.3 psi, for example.

Hope this explanation helps. I can help clarify any other details if you so inquire. I am most likely still editing this as you read, heh.

Shit my boost controller reads -15 now at idle. Max, yours is -7.3 at partial throttle then??

I understand what you're saying. Basically need to reference out the difference between mani pressure and atmosphere right?

So then, how would one go about getting the "standard" "hg from a kpa reading? I know there is a descrepancy between my Motec and autometer gauge. But when the Motec reads 50 kpa, the AM says ~14-15"hg. 10 kpa = ~25"hg. So, how does one go about converting the kpa reading to the standard "hg?

Check this link out brian: http://www.sensorsone.co.uk/pressure...onversion.html
* use the right hand side bar


Does anyone know off the top of there head if you decide to use negative lag on your primary injectors for the PFC, would you need to make you secondary injs negative too?
I changed my primaries to a -.30 last night and got my idle to about 12.9. I had to obviously re-tune my map but it was already pretty linear, all it needed was on average 20% more fuel across the board. PLUS I got my light throttle to finally read a LEAN AFR instead of always pegging 11.5afr, WOOT WOOT!!

is -15 in inches of mercury? It cannot be psi since complete vacuum on earth is -14.5psi. My idle is -7.3psi, or -15 in Hg

What units does the Motec show when you are in boost? Is it still kpa? Does the kpa value decrease when you open the throttle?

If the reading is kpa in boost:
The Motec most likely references absolute pressure. So all you have to do is a simple subtraction. Atmospheric pressure is 14.5psi, or 100kpa. Since the Motec reads 50kpa at idle, 100kpa(atmospheric) - 50kpa(gauge) = 50kpa (your vacuum), which is also equal to 14.764" Hg. Pretty smack dab where your AM reads!

Yes, it reads in kpa. 175kpa = roughly 10-11pounds of boost, becuase were subtracting the "reference" atmosphere. So, for example this morning she was idling and reading ~45-40 kpa, subtracting the "reference" gives us 55-60 kpa or 16-18 "hg as our gauges read it. Am I finally right? Can I stop cutting myself now?

Indeed, Brian, you've got it! You can stop cutting yourself, haha! I would pop open beers for us if I were there!