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-   -   FC3S Murray's never ending build. (https://rotarycarclub.com/showthread.php?t=7831)

FC3S Murray 03-25-2010 09:39 PM

A little tease for everybody:):icon_tup:


http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture025.jpg


BC's came in today, I have them installed but am dialing in the FC right now. Pics and review of coilovers and the FC ON THE GROUND will be very very soon

need RX7 03-25-2010 09:57 PM

:drool:

Looks so good. :icon_tup::icon_tup:

TitaniumTT 03-25-2010 09:57 PM

I need a towel.

So HOT Sean, looks fucking AMAZING. Still LOVE that color.

chibikougan 03-26-2010 09:03 AM

Oooh you will have to bring it out Saturday and let me touch you. I mean it! Damnit I mean your car! Haha

FC3S Murray 03-30-2010 06:09 PM

Finally an update:

So I figure I will start off with giving a small review so far on the BC Racing type BR coilovers......these things:
http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture016-1.jpg

I am very impressed by the qaulity especially since they are made in Taiwan. The coilovers came with a 1 year warrenty, the necessary adjustment tools, some product info and a SWEET decal! The whole assembly in general was solid and the craftsmanship impressive, BEST part was the include a brake line clip:icon_tup:

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture021.jpg
http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture019.jpg

Camber plates very nice BUT they peg out at -1.5 degrees because of the allen bolts hitting the bulkhead. The Dampner is fully adjustable with 30 settings.
http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture018-1.jpg
http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture020.jpg

The install on the car was easy and they came preloaded. I would say judging from when I first put the FC on the ground, the ride hieght was about stock...maybe slightly lower. They adjust just like any other coilover and I will say that the threaded cylinder turned easily IF you loosen the rear and front lower arm bolts.
http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture023.jpg



Total time to install and adjust the ride hieght accordenly was around 4 hours. I used a digital vernier caliper to measure the distance from the bottom lock ring to the small preload lock ring. This ensured linear drop. I DID have to drop the passenger front a 1/2 inch more then the drivers side though to get equal fender gap.

I also have MAXED out my MMR Rear Camber adjusters(bolt fully tightened and bottomed out)) and I am in the -1.2 degree camber in the rear.

FC3S Murray 03-30-2010 06:20 PM

Now on to my pics of the car!!

Took her out today to make sure everything was good after the winter suspension overhaul. I ended up leaving about 3/4 inch gap between the fender and tire( all you flush lovers back off:)) My reasoning is my damnper settings are semi-soft, 12 clicks past soft and these roads here SUCK ASS. Second reason I went with that ride height was with 235's up front are BEEFY and with my camber plates maxed, I wouldn't get much of a tuck....actually none at all. My tire would chew the shit out of my pretty fender and I dont want that:leaving:.

Anyway I had no issues except for the annoying smell of my new turbo blanket burning up:cuss:.....headache from the fumes. No clunks, no bushing noise, nothing which is rare from my constantly-breaking POS FC.

Here are the pics, enjoy....

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture009-1.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture004-1.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture005-1.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture014.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture013-1.jpg

FC3S Murray 03-30-2010 06:21 PM

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture015-1.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture010-1.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture007-1.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture016.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture006-1.jpg

FC3S Murray 03-30-2010 06:23 PM

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture008-2.jpg


I think it is pretty "flush":icon_tup:

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture011-1.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture012-1.jpg

FC3S Murray 03-30-2010 06:25 PM

Nothing new in the interior yet....just cleaned it up from sitting for 6 months

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture018.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...Picture017.jpg

Engine bay with new black turbo blanket and SOON water injection:driving:

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture001-2.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/w...cture002-2.jpg

Overall I am happy with the results of both my wheels and suspension. That was a shit load of work but worth it. 900 miles to go on break in and the real fun begins!

need RX7 03-30-2010 06:43 PM

I love it. Looks awesome. :icon_tup:

TitaniumTT 03-30-2010 08:08 PM

Damn Sean, probably the best looking, cleanest FC I've ever seen. You should be very proud..... DAYUM.

Those are 17x8,9 +28 F&R right? Making me want a set of 5mm spacers.

RETed 03-30-2010 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FC3S Murray (Post 114208)
Camber plates very nice BUT they peg out at -1.5 degrees because of the allen bolts hitting the bulkhead.

Did you move the allen bolts around?
I noticed that in your pic there's extra holes in the "center" of the plate - this is typical of most camber plates.
You can remove the bolts from the "top" and reinsert them in the lower positions, allowing you the get more adjustment.
Unless the sliding camber block is hitting something?


-Ted

TitaniumTT 03-30-2010 09:28 PM

Ted's right, exact same thing with my c/o's as well. There shouldn't be anything inside the tower that will limit you to 1.5. IIRC I'm running about -3 with a little more to go

FC3S Murray 03-30-2010 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by need RX7 (Post 114216)
I love it. Looks awesome. :icon_tup:

Thank you! I do too.

Quote:

Damn Sean, probably the best looking, cleanest FC I've ever seen. You should be very proud..... DAYUM.

Those are 17x8,9 +28 F&R right? Making me want a set of 5mm spacers.
Thanks Brian, coming from Mr. OCD himself that means a lot :)

Go for the spacers.

Quote:

Did you move the allen bolts around?
I noticed that in your pic there's extra holes in the "center" of the plate - this is typical of most camber plates.
You can remove the bolts from the "top" and reinsert them in the lower positions, allowing you the get more adjustment.
Unless the sliding camber block is hitting something?
Thanks Ted!!! I didn't even notice that.

project86 03-31-2010 01:04 AM

ya... i guess it looks alright....:suspect:










hhhaahahaha who am i kidding that looks way good . i like the equips alot better than the ssrs. good pickin. now i just nee to get mine on the road

TitaniumTT 03-31-2010 08:03 AM

Yeah you do, an we need more hi-res pics of your car, something that shows the pearl more damnit

project86 03-31-2010 06:23 PM

i know!!! i dont know why the camera doesnt really pick up the pearl that well... hm......

djmtsu 03-31-2010 06:43 PM

Looking VERY good man!

Now, quit being a pussy and drive that thing to DGRRX!!!!!



























Seriously, what are you chicken?

FC3S Murray 03-31-2010 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djmtsu (Post 114311)
Looking VERY good man!

Now, quit being a pussy and drive that thing to DGRRX!!!!!




























Seriously, what are you chicken?

:rofl: yeah that is a pipe dream.

TitaniumTT 03-31-2010 08:49 PM

pssssh, if you drove to DGRRX at least you'd have your engine broken in sometime during 2010 ;)

FC3S Murray 03-31-2010 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT (Post 114324)
pssssh, if you drove to DGRRX at least you'd have your engine broken in sometime during 2010 ;)

:rofl: F you brian ;) LOL!

TitaniumTT 03-31-2010 10:11 PM

:smilielol5: yeah yeah.... I'm the idiot that would drive 1-2 hundred miles a night around the state just to break in an engine in a week to make a dyno so I could auto-x the next day..... then there was the one week rebuild :rofl:

FC3S Murray 04-01-2010 08:45 AM

Hey I have a little concern with my oil pressure:
I have my idle set at 900 rpm and upon start up I have extremely high oil pressure due to running a FD regulator. Anyway when it settles at 160* oil temp the pressure is about 40 psi. After driving around and getting the oil temps around 175-180 my mechanical aftermarket Oil pressure gauges shows about 11-12 psi at idle........

This seems low. If I barely rev the rpm up to 1K(which my idle is set there now) it sits at about 17-18 psi,which is within factory spec BUT thats at 1k NOT 800 rpm.

I know what the front o-ring symptoms are and this doesn't seem like it because when I rev and drive the car i get upwards of 90 psi around 4k. 0-ring symptoms are bleed out at 40 psi and doesn't get any higher with revs.

My concern is it being that low and how low will it register when I have a long time frame of WOT pulls and get the oil temps even higher. Right now I am running Castrol GTX 10w-30. I will go to 20W-50 Mobil 1 syntheic when break in is complete.

I didnt shim the front cover regulator because I didn't know you were supposed to with the FD regulator. The Oil pump was nin perfect shape.

Any ideas? I have heard oil pressure at idle is not a big concern but I NEVER like low pressure regardless.

TitaniumTT 04-01-2010 09:00 AM

Shimming the bypass with an FD reg is only going to keep the bypass from dumping oil when the pressure gets too high. Shimming the reg brings the point where the bypass will bypass higher, it does nothing for lower pressures. Plus, FWIW, I am dropping my oil pan front cover this weekend to replace a squeezed out o-ring, I think my front cover is warped as this is the second time it's happened, and I am pulling my shims OUT. I have seen upwards of 125psi oil pressure and that's just way to high. It doesn't need to be there and is doing more damage than good in my eyes.

While your pressure is low, it's enough to raise an eyebrow but noting out of the ordinary. Did you modify any of the oil passages? Are you sure the OP was within spec? They may LOOK good, but the tolerances on them are so eff'ing tight that just a little wear will show low pressure. My pump was out of spec but it was only by a few thou, and I was in a pinch so I tossed it in... My pressure does the same thing as yours down low. When I pull my front cover I'm going to play musical oil pump parts to see if I can get a pump that falls within spec. I have like a dozen pumps but only one with the o-ring groove machined in it.

Sadly, the only thing to do is pull the front cover BUT I don't think you're at that point. I would honestly just wait and see what the bump in viscosity does. A new oil pump might be in order. Did you clean up any of the passages?

FC3S Murray 04-01-2010 10:22 AM

No I did not modify any of the oil passages. Cleaned them out really well. Used halomar to seal the pump. The pump I used was actually in better shape, I didnt measure the specs but this pump had far less visual scars then the last oil pump. New pump actually has very little to no visual scaring.

I really hate pulling the front cover........

project86 04-01-2010 10:37 AM

i would see if you could go to o shittys ( orielys) and grab a cheap ass oil pressure gauge and see if it reads any different. id hate to see you lose another motEr sean.

WE3RX7 04-01-2010 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TitaniumTT (Post 114335)
break in an engine in a week to make a dyno so I could auto-x the next day..... then there was the one week rebuild :rofl:

Possbily a connection :coolgleamA::rofl:

FC3S Murray 04-01-2010 11:28 AM

No worries Kyle, I wont be rodding it if this pressure doesnt go up.

I called mazdatrix and brianstormed with them. I did only put the teflon ring with halomar on the front cover casting, this is what Mazdatrix's rebuild video called for if you have the S5 type o-ring casting. They instructed leave the o-ring out.

Mazdatrix and I both agree this oil pressure problem is not a o-ring issue due to still getting higher pressure up in the higher rpm range BUT instead be a PUMP issue.

This figures since I swapped out the other pump from that last shit-ass motor that DID get 30 psi constantly at idle........that is what I get for visually comparing scars, BUT dammit this one I have in my motor is almost perfect.. ic ouldnt even catch a finger nail on any of the slightly visible valleys!

I mean seriously..I get upwards of 35-38 psi at 1400 rpm and it sky rockets as I climb in rpm.

What is the highest oil pressure value you guys get above 4K with the FD regulator @ normal oil operating temps? I am going to see what my highest value is once the motor is warm later today.

TitaniumTT 04-01-2010 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FC3S Murray (Post 114375)
No I did not modify any of the oil passages. Cleaned them out really well. Used halomar to seal the pump. The pump I used was actually in better shape, I didnt measure the specs but this pump had far less visual scars then the last oil pump. New pump actually has very little to no visual scaring.

I really hate pulling the front cover........

Just becuase there is no visible scarring doesn't mean that it's within spec. The one that I'm using right now looked brandy new, but it was out by a few thou. Yeah, pulling the FC sucks, especially with the engine still in the car. Is your oil pan studded? Be glad if it isn't

Quote:

Originally Posted by WE3RX7 (Post 114382)
Possbily a connection :coolgleamA::rofl:

Yeah, that one week rebuild was the one with the sticky corner seal......... bastard ;)

FC3S Murray 04-01-2010 12:10 PM

OK I found my spec notes on all my internal parts. I thought I didn't spec out my oil pump BUT i did lol...it was all a blur last summer trying to squeeze in engine time in with the new house and family.

Anyway: Between lobe measurement was .003 , FSM says between .0012-.0047

Between body and outer rotor: .009 , FSM says .0079-.0098

So it is good, not perfect BUT good. I keep researching standard oil pressure and I keep coming across 15psi (RETed). The FSM only states standard oil pressure at 3K...no idle. WTF lol? I thought i found factory oil pressure in the fsm......hmmm?

I am not too worried since it now reads 17-18 psi @ 1K. I will watch it though.

project86 04-01-2010 01:56 PM

hmmm very curious....it does seem that the op at idle isnt as pertinent as would be under wot or normal driving conditions. and not that i expected you to but im glad you dont assume anything when it comes to shit like that... as we all know .. ASSUMING=THE MOTHER OF ALL FUK UPS!

FC3S Murray 04-01-2010 09:04 PM

Well I just got back from a little drive:

at 165* F oil temp I get 79/80 psi at 3k rpm, 90 psi at 5500 rpm and 18 psi at 950 idle rpm

At 175/180*F oil temp I get 75 psi at 3K, 85-87 psi at 5500 rpm and 12-14 psi at 950 idle rpm

I bumped my idle to 1050 rpm and now she sits at 20 psi @ 180*F and 25 psi @ 160* F.

It still bothers me BUT at least my 3K test via the FSM is within spec and anything higher rpm is GREAT!

I do also wonder if this 10W-30 is a little broken down/fuel saturated from 560 miles of very rich AFR's and a shit load of sitting idle time on it(winter start ups). It still is somewhat viscous but i know our oil gets "fuely" over time.

As for my coilovers: they are doing great! I love the ride!!! I do have a slight clunk in the rear when the car gets tossed side to side from road bumps AND on sudden clutch release. My subframe looks mighty close to my diff and I wonder if these MMR adjusters clunk a little since the aluminum block doesnt fit in real snug in the trailer arm.

RETed 04-02-2010 12:08 AM

Anything above 10psi is okay.
If it starts dropping under that, I'd worry.

Here's the problem...
Unless you have a pressure gauge that is "certified" for low psi in the 5...10...15psi range, your gauge is probably not that accurate that low.
As a rule, gauges are most accurate in the middle of their range...
So a 0 - 100psi pressure gauge is most accurate around 50psi.
Trying to get a 0 - 100psi pressure gauge to read accurate down to the 5 - 15psi range is just not reasonable.

Yes, your oil is diluted from all that rich running.
Your oil pressure is going to go up.
How much is it going up? I doubt it's going to be much...
I'd be surprised if it goes up from 10psi to 15psi.
It doesn't hurt, and changing oil isn't that much of a big deal.

Now, going from a 10W30 to 20W50 *is* going to be much more of a difference.
You're basically doubling the viscocity of the oil, and that's going to change your numbers significantly.

I think you're being a little paranoid about the oil pressure, but, on the flip side, I don't blame you.
I've been through an OPR failure and an o-ring failure, and I know what the symptoms look like - you're going to see a significant drop in *max* oil pressure at higher revs; idle oil pressure is practically "0".
Remember, the engine is under very little load at idle - 10psi doesn't sound like much, but it's enough to keep everything lubed and happy.
An engine revving under load at 3k+ RPM's is going to fail a lot faster when you cut the oil pressure in half versus at idle.
Now, I'm not talking about catastrophic oil pressure loss like...NO oil pressure, which is obvious the engine is going to kill itself in short time no matter under what conditions, but I hope you get the point of this long reply... :)


-Ted

project86 04-02-2010 01:05 AM

i like long technical replies :) they make me lubed and happy... i mean happy..

FC3S Murray 04-02-2010 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RETed (Post 114451)
Anything above 10psi is okay.
If it starts dropping under that, I'd worry.

Here's the problem...
Unless you have a pressure gauge that is "certified" for low psi in the 5...10...15psi range, your gauge is probably not that accurate that low.
As a rule, gauges are most accurate in the middle of their range...
So a 0 - 100psi pressure gauge is most accurate around 50psi.
Trying to get a 0 - 100psi pressure gauge to read accurate down to the 5 - 15psi range is just not reasonable.

Yeah I am running prosport gauges...they are nice qaulity BUT I am pretty sure their low range is not as accurate as I would like and I doubt they are as accurate as a 150.00 Greddy gauge. Can't complian for a 50.00$ gauge though.

Quote:

Yes, your oil is diluted from all that rich running.
Your oil pressure is going to go up.
How much is it going up? I doubt it's going to be much...
I'd be surprised if it goes up from 10psi to 15psi.
It doesn't hurt, and changing oil isn't that much of a big deal.

Now, going from a 10W30 to 20W50 *is* going to be much more of a difference.
You're basically doubling the viscocity of the oil, and that's going to change your numbers significantly.
That is what I hope for. My idle will never drop beyond 1050 rpm so I think the pressure will be there EVEN if I have a long period of WOT pulls and get that oil thinner

Quote:

I think you're being a little paranoid about the oil pressure, but, on the flip side, I don't blame you.
I've been through an OPR failure and an o-ring failure, and I know what the symptoms look like - you're going to see a significant drop in *max* oil pressure at higher revs; idle oil pressure is practically "0".
Remember, the engine is under very little load at idle - 10psi doesn't sound like much, but it's enough to keep everything lubed and happy.
An engine revving under load at 3k+ RPM's is going to fail a lot faster when you cut the oil pressure in half versus at idle.
Now, I'm not talking about catastrophic oil pressure loss like...NO oil pressure, which is obvious the engine is going to kill itself in short time no matter under what conditions, but I hope you get the point of this long reply... :)


-Ted
Thanks man and I am glad you understand my parinoid reasoning. I am keeping in mind the "golden" rule of 10 psi for evry 1000rpm and I am DEFINITELY getting that! :)



Thanks for the encouraging post man.

FC3S Murray 04-02-2010 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by project86 (Post 114454)
i like long technical replies :) they make me lubed and happy... i mean happy..

.......you must have been lubing yourself up last night? No other reason for you to be up that late last night texting lol:rofl:

RETed 04-02-2010 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FC3S Murray (Post 114472)
Yeah I am running prosport gauges...they are nice qaulity BUT I am pretty sure their low range is not as accurate as I would like and I doubt they are as accurate as a 150.00 Greddy gauge. Can't complian for a 50.00$ gauge though.

Even if the GReddy stuff costs more, don't expect better accuracy.
My rule about the gauge accuracy holds true for all gauges unless you can show me a certified accuracy certificate.
If you ever have experience with any scientific meters for biological / chemical experiments, you'd know what I mean. :)
With accuracy comes price; if you want truly accurate pressure gauge from 0 - 100psi, with, let's say + or - 1psi error range, I would expect it to cost closer to $1,000 when it's all said and done with. :o


-Ted

project86 04-02-2010 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FC3S Murray (Post 114473)
.......you must have been lubing yourself up last night? No other reason for you to be up that late last night texting lol:rofl:

ha! i get off work late. and i was steering wheel shoping!

Max777 04-02-2010 08:05 PM

Max approved!

chibikougan 04-03-2010 11:11 AM

Ordered my Mallory and pressure regulator. Got 2 weeks to get her going for Test and Tune..:o10:


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