S4 LED Taillights Finished - Worlds First?

[My5ABaby]

Here's the project I've been working on that will debut at DGRR. Pictures is only the stop lights lit up, but I also did the turn signals. I'll get a picture of those later. :)

Due to the auto exposure the third brake light doesn't show well but it's two rows of 8 LEDs.

My next task, if possible, is to get rid of the reflector and put it somewhere else (reverse light area).

The second picture I messed with in Photoshop to show the individual LEDs more clearly.

http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5099&stc=1&d=1239722076

http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5101&stc=1&d=1239724155

Partial picture of the wiring. I spliced in probably 20 wires into the existing harness.

http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5100&stc=1&d=1239722076

[My5ABaby]

Also, there are ~60 LEDs per section (excluding the 3rd brake light of course).


--- Post also reserved for more pictures ---

[vex]

That's pretty cool, did you do the boards yourself?

[My5ABaby]

That's pretty cool, did you do the boards yourself?
Basically everything is custom. The only thing that could be considered premade are the PWM (Pulse Width Modulators) seen in the third picture (green things with all the wires run to it). The circuit boards for those were made/designed by someone else and I installed all the parts onto them. Otherwise, every LED, wire, resistor, etc. was installed by me onto blank circuit boards.

To avoid confusion, the PWM are used for dimming. They turn on and off the LEDs numerous times per second which is unnoticable to the naked eye, but does create a dimming effect. I use them for the running lights.

Here's one of the boards pre-cutting.
http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5102&stc=1&d=1239724052

[RoughRex]

Nice work, Can't wait to see how they look in person :)

[vex]

Looks pretty cool, I may have to keep my S4 Tails so I can do that sometime.

[My5ABaby]

Nice work, Can't wait to see how they look in person :)
It took quite a bit of time. I'd say I put in at least 60 hours on the project. I won't even talk about cost... :) They're basically untested so hopefully nothing will go wrong (at least until after DGRR).

[Herblenny]

WOW! Pretty cool! You need to show us what it takes to do them :) I thought about doing this for my FD.. Some day..

[PercentSevenC]

That, my friend, looks sick.

I actually prefer the S4 tails, and this looks like a great way to "modernize" them.

[N.RotaryTech]

Imagine that in S5 tail lights. :drool:

[My5ABaby]

WOW! Pretty cool! You need to show us what it takes to do them :) I thought about doing this for my FD.. Some day..

Thanks. :D

I'm contemplating on offering a retrofit service. However, I'll likely not do it and, if not, will try to do a write up. It would be for an S4, but the process will be similar for other models.

Imagine that in S5 tail lights. :drool:

I have seen several S5 retros, but no S4. All of the S5 I have seen do a single circle of roughly 20 LEDs.

[Rotary#10]

2 thumbs for you work and creativity... Looks very cool!!

[My5ABaby]

2 thumbs for you work and creativity... Looks very cool!!

Thanks. I need to get up turn signal pics to bring it all together. My next step is finishing the reverse lights. Im going to run at least 60 LEDs per side putting out 10ish lumens each. Depending on how bright that is I might bump it up to 100 per side.

[yeti]

Nice. I'm planning on doing my s5 tails one day.. Anyway I'd be willing to invest in your business if you plan on selling.

[Phoenix7]

Ok, a few important questions:

1. What's the output per LED?

2. How much current are you running to them?

3. What's the light spread look like?

I wanna see a wall lit up by the lights please!

Great job on the mod for sure, it look less like an EG from behind!

[My5ABaby]

Ok, a few important questions:

1. What's the output per LED?

2. How much current are you running to them?

3. What's the light spread look like?

I wanna see a wall lit up by the lights please!

1. I'm using Lumileds (Phillips) Superflux Red-Orange LEDs. They're around 4 lumens per LED at a conservative operating current. Datasheet: http://www.philipslumileds.com/pdfs/DS05.pdf.

I'm running roughly 120 per side and 16 in the 3rd brake light. As such, we'll say 500 lumens per side (if we split the 3rd light into two equal portions). A 1157 bulb is about 400 lumens.

2. 50mA each. They're rated at 70mA but since they may be on for an extended period of time I run them under current to ensure a long life with no heat issues (not that there really is much of a heat issue with the Superfluxes).

At ~50mA each, the ~250 LEDs are pulling 1.25A. A typical 1157 bulb pulls 2.1A, of which 4 are needed.

3. The spread is pretty good. I'd have to look at the data sheet, but I believe they're 70 degree wide angle. With the pillowing of the lenses it really doesn't matter too much. My next step is to make the boards reflective (with tape or chrome paint) to harness as much of the light as possible.

I don't have another board with 60 LEDs installed, but I could hook something up with a few to give a decent idea. I'll try to get something next week. I may also be able to compare a stock bulb on one side to my LEDs on the other. I'd have to reassemble a housing to do that though (ugh I hate that glue crap Mazda put on).

The downside, of course, is price. The LEDs are roughly $.35 each. Given that I used roughly 250 of them, it gets expensive. That's not counting the turn signals, reverse lights (not installed yet), wiring, PWMs, and so on.

As for the reverse lights, they'll be Cree P4's (same design, different manufacturer) that are rated for 30mA and output 7 lumens at that amperage. However, due to the short duration of use I'll be running them at around 70mA, which puts out about 10-11 lumens according to the datasheet. As said in an above post, I'll start with 60 per side and may work up to 100. I want them to be brighter than stock as a benefit to myself, but nothing distracting, blinding, or dangerous to anyone behind me.

Great job on the mod for sure, it look less like an EG from behind!
Thanks. :D

It's not for some people, but I like it and it's unique. The good part about the DIY aspect and not putting in premade boards is that you can put in whatever design you want. I could have done a checkerboard type pattern, vertical lines, evenly spaced, wrote "RX-7", etc.

EG as in Integra?

[Boostmaniac]

Imagine that in S5 tail lights. :drool:

+1

[My5ABaby]

Imagine that in S5 tail lights. :drool:

Are you meaning LEDs in general or my 3 line design with the non-diffused plastic?

[Phoenix7]

how awesome, thanks for the info...definitely make the back up lights brighter (i can't see mine through the tinted hatch).

A friend of mine is gonna help me with my S5 lights soon (he likes to mess around with LEDs and I'm partly blind to prove it)....I'm thinking of doing rotors in the S5 circle lights.

[DJMOJO]

not a huge fan of s4 lights myself BUT i must give props on creativity and workmanship, the only thing i have to say is i really hope you end up cleaning up the rats nest of wires but other than that it looks clean! good job!

[N.RotaryTech]

Are you meaning LEDs in general or my 3 line design with the non-diffused plastic?
LED's in general I guess.
Phoenix has a great idea about the rotor shapes.

I would go with any pattern of lines or circles just as long as it still resembles S5 circle lights.

[My5ABaby]

LED's in general I guess.
Phoenix has a great idea about the rotor shapes.

I would go with any pattern of lines or circles just as long as it still resembles S5 circle lights.
Here's some S5 tails done with LEDs. Like I said, everyone basically does the same thing.

http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=784812&highlight=LED%2A+tail%2A

I personally have a good idea that will probably be my next project. Considering I don't particularly like the S5 lights, I'll probably sell them after modifying. For now it's a secret though. :D

not a huge fan of s4 lights myself BUT i must give props on creativity and workmanship, the only thing i have to say is i really hope you end up cleaning up the rats nest of wires but other than that it looks clean! good job!
I've already cleaned it up some by putting both PWMs into a Radio Shack enclosure. In general though there's only so much I can do. I could, and likely will wrap them once I make sure everything is working correctly. But until then, you can't tell they're there with the carpet up.

[Phoenix7]

DJMOJO, please resize your gigantic signature.

yeah, I saw it in an rx7 magazine back in 2004 and thought nothing of it....the LED look has been around for a while I just doubt too many people did it right, like My5Ababy.

[My5ABaby]

DJMOJO, please resize your gigantic signature.

yeah, I saw it in an rx7 magazine back in 2004 and thought nothing of it....the LED look has been around for a while I just doubt too many people did it right, like My5Ababy.

:icon_tup: I've seen a few custom S5 ones. However, the round semi LED tail lights are becoming more common because they're essentially plug and play.

[My5ABaby]

Here's a daytime shot. It was taken with the sun almost directly behind me and shining onto the lights. In person they're a bit brighter, but I may end up making some changes since I'd like them to be brighter. Along with it are a couple comparison shots with my brother's Mazda 6. As you can see, the LEDs equal, if not surpass the output of the 6. However, both are very hard to see.

I also plan on making the boards reflective which should help noticably. I also need to disable/fix/whatever the "Stop" warning light.

P.S. Gotta love how my comparison shot involves my car being broken... :rofl:

http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5136&stc=1&d=1239921678

http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5135&stc=1&d=1239921678

http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5134&stc=1&d=1239921678

[My5ABaby]

I finished wiring up my reverse light boards. They entail about 110 white LEDs putting out ~10 lumens each. The throw of each LED is 90 degrees so it should be a nice wide spread. If they're as bright as I think they'll be after installation I may have to actually dim them some or they'll be blinding at night.

While working on them I had 4 incandescent bulbs on at various points around me. I turned those off and turned the 2 boards on and the 2 boards were brighter than the 4 bulbs combined. Granted, the light was more focused, but it doesn't matter if it's for reverse lights.

I'll have pictures as soon as possible.

[classicauto]

You da man Rob!

Looks awesome. Practice up real good and then I'll send you mine :lol:

Nice job!

[My5ABaby]

You da man Rob!

Looks awesome. Practice up real good and then I'll send you mine :lol:

Nice job!
Thanks.

I'm considering doing some more since I'm getting faster/better at it, but if I do it's not going to be cheap. The LEDs are .30 to .40 each. I'm ~450 of them, wiring, resistors, boards, voltage regulators, etc.

The problem with S4 lights (something I'm working on remedying) is the plastic is diffused and that eats a lot of light, which influenced my design. I wanted the three rows, but including that many LEDs was part looks part necessity.

On the other hand, S5 lights would likely be easier and much cheaper to do. Unfortunately I don't have a set to play with and they're expensive to buy even a crappy set.

I'm also working on another design (applicable to both S4 and S5) that would be dramatically easier to make (I think, still in the planning phase), much cheaper, and put out a lot of light.

However, at this point most everything is on hold except my project. I just graduated and am working on getting a full-time job (as opposed to my current 20 hr week graduate assistantship). As such, funds are a bit tight.

[vex]

http://rotarycarclub.com/rotary_forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5134&stc=1&d=1239921678

At first I was thinking "How and why in the hell did he space that picture just right..." and then I saw the tire.

[My5ABaby]

At first I was thinking "How and why in the hell did he space that picture just right..." and then I saw the tire.

:rofl: The tires should be back on this weekend and I'll be able to drive it for the first time in months. I think I've put on less than 200 miles this past year. :(

[My5ABaby]

Some preliminary pictures. The first two pictures are with the lamp and LEDs being on a kitchen height table. The camera settings were the same between the two pictures. The LEDs are currently running with 47k Ohm resistors and I plan on changing them to 22k Ohm (meaning about 1/3 brighter). The LED picture has some glare but it's not too far from the actual brightness. It's painful to look directly at them in the dark. I test fit them through the housing and it dims them slightly and changes the throw a bit wider.

The third picture shows one of the first boards I made. I figured I might as well put up a picture since anyone who really wanted to do it could figure it out themselves. Might as well be nice... :)

My next pictures will try to be a direct comparison of the LEDs and regular reverse light actually in the housing.

[fc3sfreak415]

BEAUTIFUL WORK!!!! ive always wanted to see someone do this

[My5ABaby]

Thanks :) :icon_tup:

I've got 1 side of the reverse lights in currently but have been too lazy to do the other side (which doesn't matter too much since my reverse switch barely works). I voltage limited them to 12v and they aren't as bright as they could be. Given that they're on for such a short amount of time I think I'm just going to run them off the alternator voltage to brighten them up some.

[88turboii]

have you thought about making a big pcb to mount all the leds and circuits to instead? or too expensive because of the size?

[My5ABaby]

have you thought about making a big pcb to mount all the leds and circuits to instead? or too expensive because of the size?
The way the tail lights are made there's dividers between each compartment so it would be basically impossible. I already had to grind down the plastic on the housing (the part closer to the car) about 3/4" to allow the PCBs to fit. It's actually a ton of work beyond just creating the PCBs. Once I learned how to wire/mount the LEDs, resistors, etc. to the PCB, those are fairly easy, just time consuming. The wiring, modifying the housings, etc. is also a huge pain. The whole project is probably about 70 hours of work, although if I knew what I was doing from the get-go it'd probably be more like 40.

[casual_john]

I'm interested in just the third brake light. Or do you think having bulbs for the taillights, but LEDs for the third middle light would look dumb?

I believe that piece would be common among all FCs, both S4 and S5.
How much if I send you my core and you modify it? Plug and play style.
(FC guys are always on a budget, you know.)

[My5ABaby]

I think it would not look good to have a mix, but I also don't have the option of making these for other people. Sorry. :(

[vex]

I think I might be doing this now. Would you mind posting or PM'ing the stuff you got/where you got it from?

[My5ABaby]

I'll see if I can find any of the info, but it's been so long I don't really remember much of it. I know I got the PWM boards and red LEDs from azdave on hidplanet.com.

[vex]

Do you at least remember the cost of everything? I would imagine somewhere above $200?

[My5ABaby]

Yes, quite a bit above $200. My guess would be somewhere around $400, if not quite a bit more. I used nearly 500 LEDs as I recall, which were something like $.30/ea. The PWMs were something like $30/ea. Part of the issue is having to order so much of some of the stuff like resistors. Minimum orders are like 100 of some that I only used 10 of.