FPR Kits?

[Raksj04]

I was looking to get a FPR for my S4 TII. I wanted to know if there were any kits out there and what kinda feed back there was from brand to brand. My fuel lines are stock, so a kit that comes with what I need to install it would be great.

[rotorlips]

you can do an sx engineering one. use the stock rails,ditch the pulsation damper . order the fittings from jegs or summit and plumb right into stock rails.then again, that all depends on if your running all the emissions, stock injectors, and so on.let me know your set up and I can advise from there.

[Raksj04]

No emissions, It is a JDM motor. I have larger secondries, running Rtek 2.1. I ditched the PD a while ago. I am also willing to change the fuel lines because I sometimes smell fuel but I have yet to see a leak.

[rotorlips]

ok. this is quite simple then . grab some braided -6 line for the fuel. you can get the fittings from jegs or summit that will screw right into both factory rails .makes for a nice clean install . braided line will go right to fuel filter and fuel return. get an sx engineering regulator 1:1 ratio for boosted motor. set pressure same as stock . youll be good to go. stock rails are quite good so no need to worry there .hope that helps. used many systems like this on many 2nd gens.

[Raksj04]

What about the SaRD standard FPR or other brands? Does anyone know what fitting will fit into the stock turbo fuel rail? also what is a good source for the -6AN fuel line and recommend lengths.

[FerociousP]

I recently did a parallel setup and used a Aeromotive A1000-6. But before I did that, I had it setup all stock with just an aftermarket FPR like in the below photo. I used pushlock hose. DO NOT USE summit pushlock hose. It is not rated for fuel for some reason. When I went parallel I used Aeroquip AQP pushlock hose. It looks and feels much tougher, and I haven't had any issues with it with a few months of use, dyno time, and 700 miles of driving to DGRR last weekend.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-ZeUSGFnnR3g/T2C0kz95M3I/AAAAAAAACPw/yJkfR0AVqCc/s640/IMG_20120313_175456.jpg

Completed parallel
Later, I added some corrugated split loom over the lines and some loop tie downs to keep the hose from abrading anything
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-wistTKIsk_4/T5leIIVmRvI/AAAAAAAACYI/wGUig8e8F2c/s800/20120320_194457.jpg
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-PBsyoa1sF2M/T5leIugElAI/AAAAAAAACYQ/QEPpo1Ff7aY/s800/20120320_194543.jpg

http://fc3spro.com/TECH/MODS/FUEL/fsystem.htm

fitting to screw into the back of the secondary rail. It has a oring/washer combination for sealing.
EAR-991945
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EAR-991945ERL/
http://fc3spro.com/TECH/MODS/FUEL/solex6.jpg

I got mine all from summit
Aeromotive A1000-6 FPR
Aeroquip AQP pushlock hose
Mix of summit and Aeroquip 45deg, 90deg fittings
*of the two fittings, Aeroquip installed more "confidently" during tightening and felt of much higher quality. I recommend spending the extra few dollars on their fittings or another name brand. The last thing you need is a fuel leak.

[Raksj04]

what are the benifits of running a parallel fuel system?

[FerociousP]

what are the benifits of running a parallel fuel system?

When using larger injectors, especially in the primaries, there is less disturbance/spikes/drops/etc to fuel flow for all of the injectors when they click open... there is also increased flow when you run two lines all the way back or in this case use a 3/8" feed instead of the stock 5/16". But, none of this matters until higher power levels anyway.

If you just want to have control over your fuel pressure and have a newer part than a 20+ yr ol FPR... just add a new FPR to the end of the line using the part listed and call it a day.

[FerociousP]

ok. this is quite simple then . grab some braided -6 line for the fuel. you can get the fittings from jegs or summit that will screw right into both factory rails .makes for a nice clean install . braided line will go right to fuel filter and fuel return. .

-6 braided line is 3/8" ID. You shouldn't be just clamping it down on a 5/16" fuel filter outlet. For the return you don't need to change the hose (or at least spend money on expensive hose) because there is no pressure.

[Raksj04]

that hose isnt cheap. how much did you end up using?

[FerociousP]

that hose isnt cheap. how much did you end up using?

You can see in my pics how much I used.

the minimum on summit was 20ft I believe. Yes, its expensive, and so are the fittings... but they also have less chance of firey death. I'm sure you can find someone on here to ship you a 2ft piece of leftover hose if all you want to do is an FPR on the end.

This will not be a cheap endeavor using AN line. Get used to $10-15 for individual fittings. If you want cheap, I have a new stock replacement FPR (used for 6months) that I will sell you for $35 shipped

[Raksj04]

I may redo all the lines. I redid them a few years ago but that was with cheap autozone hose and since I sometimes smell fuel when driving I want to be sure that it isn't leaking near the hottess part of the car. Can this hose just be cut?
Thanks for the offer but I am replace the stock one with an adjustable one to help fix an issue I have.

[RETed]

I redid them a few years ago but that was with cheap autozone hose and since I sometimes smell fuel when driving I want to be sure that it isn't leaking near the hottess part of the car.
How cheap is "cheap"?
"Fuel injection" hose is very expensive - even from Autozone.
It's going to cost almost the same as this push-on or SS AN stuff.
It should cost close to $10 / foot?
If you paid like $1 - $2 / foot, it's the WRONG HOSE.

Thanks for the offer but I am replace the stock one with an adjustable one to help fix an issue I have.
I dunno what you're trying to do, but messing with an adjustable FPR usually gets you into more trouble.
At the very least, you need to monitor fuel (rail) pressures to have an idea what is going in.


-Ted

[Raksj04]

I dunno what you're trying to do, but messing with an adjustable FPR usually gets you into more trouble.
At the very least, you need to monitor fuel (rail) pressures to have an idea what is going in.


-Ted



I had the issue of hesition and wild AFR fluxs when the car is in the closed loop mode. I have a RTEK 2.1 walbro 255 and larger secondry fuel injectors. From what I have read increasing the fuel pressure or just upgrading to FPR to one that can handle the increased flow of the fuel pump will fix the issue. I do plan on getting a fuel pressure gauge with this setup.

[Sharingan 19]

Your lean afrs during cruise are not caused by the stock FPR or its lack of adjustment. The Wlabro 255 will outflow the stock FPR and if anything will cause a rich condition, not lean. Raising your static fuel pressure might mask the problem but that's no the same as finding the real source.

[Raksj04]

Your lean afrs during cruise are not caused by the stock FPR or its lack of adjustment. The Wlabro 255 will outflow the stock FPR and if anything will cause a rich condition, not lean. Raising your static fuel pressure might mask the problem but that's no the same as finding the real source.

Lean isn't the issue it is the 2 to 3 lamba bounce I get at cruise that I worry about and I am trying to fix.

[Sharingan 19]

bouncing between what and what? (in afr please, when did we start talking about lambda?)

[Raksj04]

bounce from 12.0 to 16.0

[TitaniumTT]

I had the issue of hesition and wild AFR fluxs when the car is in the closed loop mode. I have a RTEK 2.1 walbro 255 and larger secondry fuel injectors. From what I have read increasing the fuel pressure or just upgrading to FPR to one that can handle the increased flow of the fuel pump will fix the issue. I do plan on getting a fuel pressure gauge with this setup.

There's your problem

Your lean afrs during cruise are not caused by the stock FPR or its lack of adjustment. The Wlabro 255 will outflow the stock FPR and if anything will cause a rich condition, not lean. Raising your static fuel pressure might mask the problem but that's no the same as finding the real source.

Except that walbro's, whinboros', walsucks, wilpuke, all those pumps are HORRIBLE pieces of crap. I wouldn't trust one on an n/a car. Garbage

Lean isn't the issue it is the 2 to 3 lamba bounce I get at cruise that I worry about and I am trying to fix.

You don't understand Lambda, do you?

bouncing between what and what? (in afr please, when did we start talking about lambda?)

We can't be, mathematically a 2-3 lambda bouce would be 29-43:1

bounce from 12.0 to 16.0

That's AFR's, not Lambda. Lambda = actual AFR/14.7

[Raksj04]

I mixed the two up it is my mistake. I meant AFR.

[Raksj04]

So what is the answer then? what type of fuel pump should I use?

[Sharingan 19]

Indeed TTT, do tell... Is your disdain for Walbro pumps your way of saying this sounds like pump failure or more along the lines of an endorsement for some uber expensive alternative that you prefer?

Rick, did you ever figure out what injectors you're running? Having the wrong presets selected probably wouldn't make for the best running conditions.

[FerociousP]

afr swings at cruise are most likely attributed to the ecu falling in and out of closed loop... or not even reaching closed loop... and that could be to a variety of reasons.

Almost none of those reasons would have to do with fuel pressure. Are you running a stock 1-wire O2 for the stock ecu? If not, are you using the simulated 0-1 volt out on your wideband to the O2 input on the ecu? Have you made any adjustments to the cruise area of the map where it is now too lean and causing hesitation? If your ecu even reaching closed loop mode?

I don't think you are looking in the right place to fix your problem. These ecus were designed to work in a stock capacity with stock components... Its very easy to make a change that the ecu cannot compensate for, or even knows about. Yes these are old ecus with old technology, but the technology worked for many years before people started modifying them.

[Raksj04]

I beileve that they are 720's if I change the computer to anything else it is scary.

when I 1st posted this I was directed to another thread on the evil fourm that stated a few people had the same issue and their fix was to replace the FPR and turn up the pressure a little. I also read in street rotary that running a high fuel pressure could help to atomize the fuel better.

[Raksj04]

afr swings at cruise are most likely attributed to the ecu falling in and out of closed loop... or not even reaching closed loop... and that could be to a variety of reasons.

Almost none of those reasons would have to do with fuel pressure. Are you running a stock 1-wire O2 for the stock ecu? If not, are you using the simulated 0-1 volt out on your wideband to the O2 input on the ecu? Have you made any adjustments to the cruise area of the map where it is now too lean and causing hesitation? If your ecu even reaching closed loop mode?

I don't think you are looking in the right place to fix your problem. These ecus were designed to work in a stock capacity with stock components... Its very easy to make a change that the ecu cannot compensate for, or even knows about. Yes these are old ecus with old technology, but the technology worked for many years before people started modifying them.

it is a narrow output from the wideband. I haven't driven the car with the pda hooked up in a while. However the AFR will bounce inbetween 2,500 to 3,500 Rpm with low vaccum. When I get on in even into boost the AFR will stay pretty steady.

[TitaniumTT]

afr swings at cruise are most likely attributed to the ecu falling in and out of closed loop... or not even reaching closed loop... and that could be to a variety of reasons.

Almost none of those reasons would have to do with fuel pressure. Are you running a stock 1-wire O2 for the stock ecu? If not, are you using the simulated 0-1 volt out on your wideband to the O2 input on the ecu? Have you made any adjustments to the cruise area of the map where it is now too lean and causing hesitation? If your ecu even reaching closed loop mode?

I don't think you are looking in the right place to fix your problem. These ecus were designed to work in a stock capacity with stock components... Its very easy to make a change that the ecu cannot compensate for, or even knows about. Yes these are old ecus with old technology, but the technology worked for many years before people started modifying them.

Whoops... forgot to mention what I thought the original issue was.... I'm voting TPS.

Indeed TTT, do tell... Is your disdain for Walbro pumps your way of saying this sounds like pump failure or more along the lines of an endorsement for some uber expensive alternative that you prefer?

If it's not pump failure it will be soon

My ubber expensive hella reliable badass pump that I use in my own car is a stock supra TT pump ;)

[Sharingan 19]

afr swings at cruise are most likely attributed to the ecu falling in and out of closed loop... or not even reaching closed loop... and that could be to a variety of reasons.
I've driven this car and there doesn't even seem to be anything wrong. Honestly, there were no complaints about how it drove before he installed the wideband, but now that there are numbers that change, there must be an issue. My honest opinion is that this is more a case of observation bais than anything else. But what is being observed is most likely what you're referring to. In cruise I see 14.5-16 afr and under light to moderate acceleration it dips down to 12's and 13's....nothing special there.


I don't think you are looking in the right place to fix your problem. These ecus were designed to work in a stock capacity with stock components... Its very easy to make a change that the ecu cannot compensate for, or even knows about. Yes these are old ecus with old technology, but the technology worked for many years before people started modifying them.
The Rtek 2.1 has the capacity to adjust fuel and timing so its certainly more flexible than the stock ecu....for example the ability to datalog. Rick take some logs and post them and point out exactly where the problem is occuring. Doing so will allow you/us to see what the TPS value, inj duty cycle, afr and other parameters are and allow us to do more than guess at what the problem is.

Whoops... forgot to mention what I thought the original issue was.... I'm voting TPS.

quite possibly


My ubber expensive hella reliable badass pump that I use in my own car is a stock supra TT pump ;)
Hard to beat OEM for reliability. I got rid of my walbro (came installed on the car when I got it) and installed an FD pump because 1) it was loud as hell and 2) it caused the car (otherwise completely stock) to run rich, smoke on start up and occasionally not want to hot start.

[Raksj04]

The car also has issues idling after 1st start up it will be fine after a few mintues of driving but it will sometimes drop really low when I put the clutch in for a stop. It will die in the 1st 5 mins of driving.

[Raksj04]

Also my logs will only be with narrow band inputs I haven't wired it up for datalogging yet

[Raksj04]

I have some logs but I am not sure how to share them.

[Sharingan 19]

The instructions for hooking up the wideband for datalogging are in your Rtek instruction manual. Do this now.

Once you have logs worth sharing, we'll discuss how to post them. Or you can look in the Rtek section on the other forum where both topics have been discussed at length time and time again....

[Raksj04]

I am going home for about a week tonight. I just have to find the female pin size that will work for my Wideband. Then I will get that setup.